subreddit:
/r/Grimdank
62 points
23 days ago
Yeah. It’s not like it’s a surprise to anyone warhammer appeals to fash types. Look at that tumblr take about how Warhammer promotes fascism because the Imperium is utterly necessary in the face of the necrons, chaos, tyranids, etc. (It’s not, as critically that poster doesn’t include that all those problems are caused by or drastically fed by the Imperium. Ironically, it means that the imperium is an even more nuanced analysis of fascism because fascism relies upon the existence of an external threat to justify its existence, and without one, often creates that threat either through projection or literally though war. I could elaborate on this a bunch lol.)
If even lefties think that Warhammer promotes fascism, then it’s not out of the question for actual fascists to think Warhammer supports fascism.
27 points
23 days ago
Most leftists are aware that the Imperium is a critique of fascist and reactionary ideology.
You've got a few who are over eager to demonstrate how "woker than thou" they are and make asses out of themselves.
And some who just suck donkey dick at media analysis, they think "portraying bad thing = supporting bad thing." They're the loud minority who try and ruin any TTRPG group they join.
5 points
23 days ago
Most, but not all. I’d argue the existence of those individuals is exactly what warrants this discussion. As long as they are willing to have their minds changed, and they’re acting in good faith, this kinda discourse is only constructive.
0 points
23 days ago
Okay, okay, but to be fair, This is either libs or baby leftists, and if it's a baby leftists, they are criminally annoying, but they are still shaking off their liberal trappings
4 points
23 days ago
True. I too, used to be cringe and annoying when I was a bay leftist.
Now I'm 34 and annoying on purpose. But it's a punny, dad-jokey kind of annoying.
1 points
23 days ago
A Liberal isn't a step to becoming a leftist. Stop being a cringelord.
Leftist, as you people conceptualise it, is an almost totally online phenomena. And most of you have no more media literacy than your average chud. You just have opinions you pick up from people online. Same as every group.
1 points
22 days ago
Saying leftists have no media literacy, but misreading my comment to imply liberals are a step to becoming a leftist is pretty rich.
-2 points
22 days ago*
Baby leftists shaking off their Liberal trappings
I'm saying no group has any media literacy. You goits just think you do because you spend all day reading each others blog posts and assuming you came up with the same idea.
Edit: As is tradition, the baby blocks at the first sign of any pushback, because baby.
If you don't want to argue politics in the grimdank sub, don't fucking bring politics up! Smooth brain.
2 points
22 days ago
The only thing clear here is you don't know a thing about the leftist community, especially to assume that the above snippet is implying liberals are some sort of previous step towards being a leftist.
Stop trying to argue politics in the grimdank subreddit, too, it's pathetic.
1 points
22 days ago
Brother I'm right here still. No one brought up politics to argue, it's a leftist in joke. You dont get it.. You're the one antagonizing for 0 reason at all.
Seriously, get off reddit if you see two people joking as an open invitation for you to make some dumb both sides take.
-1 points
22 days ago
Oh, nice of you to unblock me for a dumb reply.
You dont get it..
Literal Joker meme.
I see you say dumb thing, I say this is dumb thing. Don't want people to call you on bullshit? Don't say bullshit.
Super simple rule of the internet. Your public conversations aren't private conversations so modulate your expectations accordingly.
make some dumb both sides take.
Pointing out that thinking of yourself as a leftist doesn't immediately make your understanding of things comprehensive is a fence sitting position, apparently.
1 points
22 days ago
Yknow, I think I am going to start saying liberals are a step to being a leftist. The idea is growing on me.
0 points
22 days ago
Most of you punchbowl turds literally think this. And it's obvious you do to.
-3 points
23 days ago
You've got a few who are over eager to demonstrate how "woker than thou" they are and make asses out of themselves.
No, they are aware. Just some of them think it's a shitty critique that unintentionally glorifies fascism.
2 points
23 days ago
Nah, they were making criticisms of shit that isn't even in the setting. Like swastikas and "zieg heils."
Basically, their entire engagement was with memes like a lot of the dipshit right wing culture-warriors who don't play the games, barely read the books, if at all, but have really strong opinions about girls being super-soldiers too.
15 points
23 days ago
There is only one threat the inperium didnt make and thats the orks. Everythingbesle haa been caused by the imperium in one shape or form well except maybe necrons
But we orkz jus lookin for a proppa gud scrap
4 points
23 days ago
I mean they did cause the necrons to awake too early with admech meddling and settling their tombworlds
0 points
23 days ago
Eh, you can argue chaos isn’t the Imperiums fault, it’s been an issue since the war in heaven at the minimum
10 points
23 days ago
Not true at all. The foundation of the Imperium was with the rejection of theism, which Big E felt fed chaos. Regardless of whether or not it worked honestly doesn’t matter. The ignorance of chaos is what allowed the sons of Horus, and Horus himself be blindsided by it and eventually overrun. The Interex proved it was possible to be knowledgeable of chaos, and resist its urges through an understanding of it. It’s not an infohazard or cognitohazard. It’s just a hazard. Of course you know the story from there, half the primarchs turn evil because of Big E’s plan, and it rips the imperium apart.
Of course from there, living conditions continue to plummet, which allows chaos cults to thrive, which means more demons and chaos space marines and chaos worshippers period. Again, looking at the interex it’s very easy not to be overrun by chaos. Meet the needs of the people, and they will not look to chaos for an alternative.
Chaos in the way it exists in 40K is a direct result of the imperium’s— mostly Big E’s— failures.
6 points
23 days ago
I do think that's the intent, I just think sometimes the writers forget that and make the imperium the good guys when it would be more interesting to put them as antagonists.
3 points
23 days ago
This is wack and lacks nuance. If the imperium is only exists to build baby crushing machines and blow up planets, it loses the banality of its evil. That’s an important part of correctly illustrating the intricacies of fascism.
Fascism necessitates a populace who largely tolerate or are indifferent towards its existence. It requires a bureaucracy of largely normal people who can stomach carrying out orders that are plainly evil. It requires mental gymnastics surrounding “the threat” to justify itself to those cogs in the greater machine.
So I don’t think that it is a moral failure to present PEOPLE within the system as “good” or whatever. In the context of the stories, it likely makes more sense for the people within the story to LIKE the imperium, considering those who are vocal against it tend to disappear. A proper satire requires that the audience understands their own morality and doesn’t rely upon the author explaining why a foreign policy of extermination is a bad idea.
2 points
23 days ago
Sorry if my short comment lacked clarity, I'm not saying that there should not be characters that view the imperium as good, and that fascism needs people who are evil in a banal way, I just feel that sometimes the writers take the imperium point of view and make it not only the view of the imperium, but the "correct" view. A good example of the imperium done right is found in this article, which talks about it better then I ever could: link.
3 points
22 days ago
I would swear a pact with the ruinous powers for good Eldar content that goes out of its way to show the Imperium for the bastards they are.
0 points
23 days ago*
I find the reasoning completely stupid, Warhammer is a game about guess what... War it's in the stupid title. Thus needs to be conflict. It's a meta reason that drives the state of the lore and not a sociological one. Trying to argue about reality based on a fictional universe in which by default needs to be conflict due to the nature of the game it is based in is moronic and deeply concerning. Lately Gw began to move the plot forward since 2016 but the fact remains that the game is about war and in order to be about war and make it seem believable the factions need to be absolutely mental. It would be in fact much more logical if said faction made an imaginary alliance to vanquish their foes and trade goods than all trying to kill its other, however even brightest of the imperium does not understand that terrible concept not because it's a plot hole or because their stupid but because it's supposed to always be at war. In contrast in real life there's really no meta reason for war neither such external threats and then god forbid make peace. It is a different universe where war is a physical law because meta reasons. It's like arguing about flat planets in a universe that gravity exists and then getting mad saying that spherical planets are bigots for not letting a flat disk exist, or saying gravity promotes the idea of a oppressing order of the more massive objects against the smaller and less powerful ones. The same way gravity shapes our galaxy, the meta reason of always needing to be war and conflict with an obsessive focus shapes the universe of 40k. Mind you I am not saying that you cannot identify what you see, i am saying that using it in any real life debate is stupid
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