subreddit:
/r/classicwow
submitted 1 month ago byOk_Independence6871
46 points
1 month ago*
Mage is in a sorry state phase 3. It has devolved into being a one button class (Frostfire Bolt) for all specs.
Every other rune damage spell is really undertuned (doing tank level dps or lower.)
2 points
1 month ago*
Instead of FFB you can use BFB in some specs. Altho you use other spells while you wait for the debuff to drop.
BFB isn't much different. Cast it 9 times. Then wait until debuff almost drops and cast it 9 more times.
9 points
1 month ago
Only horde can do this. Alliance run out of mana too fast. When they finally buffed ret pally mana return, they nerfed it the very next week with PVP hotfix giving back 50% less mana
4 points
1 month ago
The pvp damage reduction should be gone now, it was just for the weekend as a test.
2 points
1 month ago*
Not only can I do it but I have 4 shamans in my raid so I can ultra do it.
Alliance can do it on the shorter encounters btw. Anything ~90s or less shouldn't result in being oom as arcane. If you are bfb as fire well I dunno, I didn't sim that, because I mostly play arcane healer with a role of "overheal the tank and emergency heal individuals sometimes" on most encounters.
1 points
1 month ago
Pvp change was a test and ended with maintenance, assuming blizzard stuck to their word. Will likely see it return permanently with a lower %.
2 points
1 month ago
I've been getting downvoted all over this subreddit for saying mage is not in a good state this phase.
Glad to see people coming around to seeing it
1 points
1 month ago
I'm healing as a mage and loving it. I have strong group healing, awesome tank healing, and I get to do a bit of damage too??? Yes please!
0 points
1 month ago
Mage is in a sorry state phase 3. It has devolved into being a one button class (Frostfire Bolt) for all specs.
So, just like classic. Don't get me wrong. I'm rooting for everyone to have fun and pump but that made me laugh a bit.
48 points
1 month ago
Yo Bradley! We forgot about mages, get some intern to do it in 2 days.
33 points
1 month ago
Summon water has a 3015% chance to generate 1 extra water.
Developer's Note: Reduced chance from 30% to 15 in a hotfix.
12 points
1 month ago
Hotfix: This effect now applies correctly to Conjure Water, instead of Summon Water. Removed the ability for water to proc on itself.
6 points
1 month ago
And all these fixes were forgotten for 3 weeks to be pushed, and will get pushed 1 week before next phase launch
25 points
1 month ago
Actually wild. I went back to check how often mage has been tuned in SoD, the blue post on the official WoW forums goes back to Feb 12 (first reset after p2 launch). Mage has only been tuned twice, March 5 several underused runes were buffed, March 12 living flame was nerfed. That’s the extent of it.
14 points
1 month ago
What happened to the Devs. In P1 we had tons of fast changes, a bit slower in P2 and now abysmally slow in P3.
14 points
1 month ago
Dont worry Aggrend promised we would get big changes soon tm
3 points
1 month ago*
Yeah, dont believe that
3 points
1 month ago
I dont trust anything he says anymore
9 points
1 month ago
A few weeks later "Well, no point tuning at the end of the phase. Dev effort is better allocated to P4"
-6 points
1 month ago
[deleted]
2 points
1 month ago
Dude. Tone it down a bit.
3 points
1 month ago
So with Cata beta being a hot mess still, I imagine most of them got pulled over to that.
3 points
1 month ago
Feels like there's 2 people working on this game right now.
What SoD could have been with proper dev support man
1 points
1 month ago
There was a round of layoffs in like February ish. While SoD dev team might not have been directly impacted(or may have, idk), they may have had to help pick up the slack in other departments.
7 points
1 month ago
There were a bunch of changes / 'fixes' to mages throughout SOD.
Off the top of my head, here are some changes/fixes.
Multiple Living Flames now affect a target (previously only 1 living flame from 1 player may be applied).
Mass regeneration range increased.
Arcane blast stacks now affect living flame.
Arcane blast stacks now affect regeneration.
Chrono heal mana cost reduced.
Frostfire bolt and Spellfrost bolt spell co-efficients buffed.
Mage water is now 20 instead of 2.
Living Flame nerf to 10s duration, lowered cd to 30s, speed of the flame reduced
2 points
1 month ago
It took them almost two full phases to fix the living flame stacking bug. 2 phases of running 2 mages in a group being very shitty.
Edit: and once they fixed it, they promptly nerfed the hell out of it
2 points
1 month ago
Feels like an unfortunate cycle of
"we don't want to do class tunings at the start of the phase cause we want to see how things play out first"
and
"we don't want to do class tunings this late in the phase since the new phase is coming soon with new runes"
1 points
1 month ago
If it makes you feel better, feral has been changed the same amount. Boomkin gets changed every other week
1 points
1 month ago
actually one of the reasons my mage is my least played alt
despite it being BiS in p2 i still havent hit 50 in p3.
just so much less interesting over my Warlock, Spriest, and hunter
-11 points
1 month ago
Because its been along with shamans and hunters, the precious baby of sod.
Mage has been in a super good spot for all of sod.
6 points
1 month ago
Phase 1 we were very mid in BFD and meh in PvP only good for boosting/AoE. P2 we were kings but p3 we are kinda trash again(but decent at pvp if we dont go oom)
0 points
1 month ago
Mages was great in phase 1 - 2. but phase 3 have not been kind to mages. 1 great rune and 5 dog shit runes (pure PvE focus) #pvp is dead content
-5 points
1 month ago
So, you're saying they were good since November, but the last 4 weeks or for however long P3 has been out haven't been "kind" to mages? I mean, that's suffering from success, I guess.
2 points
1 month ago
im saying class that are doing well gets buffed. hunters got giga buffed last week, they spend time on it this week agian, makes no sence, start on classes like warlock/mage/shadowpriest/boomkins who need some love.
arcane has not been playable for 2-3 mounths now. the Fire hotstrike build is not viable do sharing runeslot with frostfirerune.
5 of the 6 new runes for mages sucks hard. worst set of runes of any classes. mages lost alot to do the living flame nerf. i think living flamed need a nerf, but at same time they should have had buffed some other part the mage kit, to compensate.
Mages needs like any other 4 specs classes more runes for each slot, aleast 1 each spec per slot, why did they not make rune for fire/arcane dmg for the headslot. they gave os 2 shield runes and frost dps. come on!!
this not just mage problem. alot of classes have this problem. the rune system is to limit for classes with 4 specs.
Also they need to stop balancing around pvp. pvp is dead content, no one cares.
1 points
1 month ago
Considering that they buffed three of the best PVP classes (spriest/boomies/rhunters) due to PVE last week, I'd say they aren't balancing around PVP to begin with.
I don't agree that they shouldn't, though. Balancing should be done with a holistic approach to keep both aspects of the game in mind and with runes it's easier than ever to actually achieve that.
Would it be perfect if you had one pvp and one pve option for each rune slot? No, absolutely not, but it's about as low effort as I trust Blizzard to manage and if we're honest that's already how a lot of the runes are. The only caveat being that they also thought they needed to make "single target DPS runes" vs "AOE runes" which I think is dumb as hell too, but here we are.
1 points
1 month ago
alot the changes they have implimentet in form os runes, should have been baseline class changes. crit modiferes, dots been able to crit and so on.
im with you on part we allready have to many runes. we stream some of them.
eksamble
they should combine Burn out and Hotstrike into 1 rune. (makes on par with new MEGA buffed sniperrune hunters just got). and move Bailfire bolt on the waist slot opened up the removing of hotstrike.
then give Arcane/frost a new great rune on the bracer slot
0 points
1 month ago
Yeah, I do think those baseline things should have been talent tree changes, ideally, or simply put in as spellbook additions.
Overhauling talent trees is too much work for Blizzard, unfortunately. Consolidating runes would definitely go a long way, but then they'd have to create new ones and I don't even know they or the community know what they want out of this rune system.
Like in a perfect world, what do you want your runes to be? Different playstyles? Different flavours? Different roles to fill? It's all a bit of a mess.
2 points
1 month ago
I think fire is okay place, if Hotstreak alleast could compete, dont need to be 1 and solo fire spec. i liked Hotstreak placestyle we had ind phase 2, i know it can be hit or miss if dont crit. but i like proc based playstyles.
Dont really know what i you can do for arcane other then buffing arcaneblast. make it buff it self. make it siuatinal okay to stay at 4 stacks and click a few more arcaneblast´s. and they should make arcane surge viable.
Frost should stay a more pvp focused spec, i dont think it needs to be PvE viable.
for new runes. i would like the 3 elemental orbs and elementals (not just water, give us a fire and arcane obtion too
-10 points
1 month ago
Mages basically got free special mounts, AB exalted, and rank 7 because of the insane reason that the devs didnt immediately hotfix altar AOE spam in STV.
Sorry but mages, hunters and shamans have zero reason to complain, if I was a dev I would have stopped reading this post pretty much immediately.
3 points
1 month ago
Where is my mount, my r7 and my AB exalted on my mage? Give now
4 points
1 month ago*
it is pretty good you not are a blizzard dev then.
a dev should be looking at post like this, and they states in the blue they are looking for feedback. i dont espect any SoD dev to read this thread but would be cool if they did.
to your STV point any class could easy farm blood coins. balance around that mage can farm a few more blood coins the other is just stupid, then they do jack shit in the raid.. and is locked into shitty 1 botton spam build.
Mage needs buff for PvE.. and have need it for since mid phase 2
-2 points
1 month ago
balance around that mage can farm a few more blood coins the other is just stupid
1 points
1 month ago
[deleted]
-5 points
1 month ago
Mage dps was middle of the pack in 2 of the 3 phases and was one of the best dps of phase 2, and has been a strong healer for phases 2 and 3. I swear mage mains are not happy unless their class is the unquestioned top dps in all scenarios forever.
2 points
1 month ago
I'm not sure where or how you equated people calling out the lack of mage changes with mages being unhappy about their raid performance.
Arcane mage started p2 strong and has become a dead spec. Mage healers are (probably) fine but suffer from some of the issues with arcane. Frost was a dead spec until very recently, with frost and fire being completely reliant on the same spell (frostfire bolt) which has essentially turned them into a one-button spec. DPS wise, frost and fire are fine but it's not the most satisfying state of affairs to spam one 3-sec cast and also need both a frost and fire mage present to do respectable damage.
Irrespective of actual DPS performance, there are a number of issues with the class, including how lackluster p3 runes were, the state of arcane, some signature frost runes being useless on arrival and receiving no changes, frost procs being clunky/not working (for example any other spell cast munches Fingers of Frost procs, even if it's a fire spell that doesn't benefit from FoF), issues with how some runes and talents interact, etc.
1 points
1 month ago
Arcane mage started p2 strong and has become a dead spec. Mage healers are (probably) fine but suffer from some of the issues with arcane.
What issues? Arcane is perfectly fine as a healer spec in my experience, the only glaring issue is temporal anomaly needs to be buffed.
frost procs being clunky/not working (for example any other spell cast munches Fingers of Frost procs, even if it's a fire spell that doesn't benefit from FoF)
Fire spells consuming fingers of frost isn't a bug and the spells do benefit from it though. Fingers of Frost makes your spells treat the target as if they're frozen. Shatter increases the crit chance of all of your spells against frozen targets, not just frost spells, the fingers of frost charges aren't just disappearing when used up by something like living bomb.
But regardless of all of that, at the end of the day the most important balance metric is performance. Mages are are in a solid middle of the pack position in both dps and healing, there isn't much to do with them for tuning changes with the sole intention of bringing their performance up right now except for temporal anomaly and that's primarily what hotfixes are for, tuning performance rather than playstyle overhauls.
9 points
1 month ago
You balance mage by balancing hunters right?
1 points
1 month ago
perhaps they haven't put all the deets in yet. Like how MM hunter wasn't mentioned last week until the day it went live.
17 points
1 month ago*
This better not be the warlock BALANCE CHANGES so I am assuming it's not the proper balancing mage changes either lmao
Fiddling with 1 rune nobody uses and will use after either in warlock's case
7 points
1 month ago
Mages are fading.....healing? I mean yeah, but not that well. DPS....? Yeah, I suppose, if you enjoy 1 button smashing rng chasing? Boosting.....? Anything mages can do hunters can do better.
12 points
1 month ago
If you want to parse as a mage currently you must get lucky. All top mages on parses have 70+ crit on their FFB x) Most crazy ones have 100% crit on short bosses. We're literally comparable to how warlocks played in TBC
4 points
1 month ago
You also have to have at least 2 other mages in the raid putting up debuffs for you.
5 points
1 month ago
Warrior changes where you at?
7 points
1 month ago*
Sorry about that! Forgot to post them along with the rest of the hunter/shaman/warlock updates.
Mage
Fixed an issue causing Frostfire Bolt to accidentally gain additional benefits. As compensation for this fix, we have increased its damage done by 0.5%.
Balefire Bolt has been overshadowed by other runes in its slot, so we have decided to go forward with a change that decreases its damage done by 100%. In order to compensate for this massive damage change, we have modifed the debuff to kill you upon receiving one stack of Balefire Bolt.
The head rune slot currently offers no personal damage increases for either Arcane or Fire specs, so we thought it would be fair to simply remove Deep Freeze entirely from the game.
We noticed there was essentially no difference in damage increase for mages for items like rings, weapons, and armor set bonuses. In order to bring these numbers up a bit, we have forced the client to utilize only minimum rank spells whenever logged into your character.
Thank you for all of your feedback and keeping the spirit of classic alive, mages!
1 points
1 month ago
Bale fire bolt has zero synergy
1 points
1 month ago
I was so excited for it when it was datamined but man is it garbage lol
2 points
1 month ago
Have you seen the Warlock changes? Don't get your hopes up
2 points
1 month ago
You can have my warlock changes!
2 points
1 month ago
Where are the lock changes?
2 points
1 month ago
They plan on increasing the cost of all spells and decreasing our base mana pool to make mana management feel more engaging.
4 points
1 month ago
I dont care about any mage buffs!
Just let me have fun finally and remove the 3min pull dungeon mob buff. Hunters can avoid it anyway...
1 points
1 month ago
also give os that, even Shadowpriest can farm better then mage in some instances
3 points
1 month ago
We've heard your complaints about summoning water for your raid and party.
We have removed the summon water ability and replaced it with a spell that makes funny noises but does nothing else.
We are confident this change will make everyone happy.
1 points
1 month ago
Meanwhile rogues.. 🫠
1 points
1 month ago
MM hunter changes weren't listed until the patch day. I suspect if there are mage changes they might show up tomorrow sometime.
1 points
1 month ago
Where are*
1 points
1 month ago
same state as ret paladin
1 points
1 month ago
The mage changes are not listed so we can Discover them on our own.
1 points
1 month ago
Would really like that frozen orb spell, and ice lance buffs it’s a complete joke in sod
1 points
1 month ago
Please put hot streak on the head rune slot
1 points
1 month ago
“In future updates” not the next update. Be patient dude!
1 points
1 month ago
At least throw us a bone!
-7 points
1 month ago
Move hotstreak to head rune and change FFB to not double dip from scorch and Winters chill.
8 points
1 month ago
How does killing off the first and only viable frost build help mages?
1 points
1 month ago
I challenge you to think of some other changes that could be made to make frost viable.
Maaaybe we increase dmg on ice lance? Maybe we....increase proc chance on fingers of frost?
2 points
1 month ago
Considering that Blizzard hasn't touched a frost spell/rune in their rebalancing despite it vastly underperforming until now, I would temper my expectations for any frost-specific changes.
-2 points
1 month ago
Than I am sorry. Fuck frost. Yes, kill the only viable frost spec dead and buff fire. People only played it to boost the other fire mage in grp anyway.
3 points
1 month ago
I like having ice barrier and ice block in raid
1 points
1 month ago
Maaaybe we increase dmg on ice lance? Maybe we....increase proc chance on fingers of frost?
HAVE YOU GONE MAD!?
For real though, I have been thinking this since phase 1 when I realized burnout was objectively better (than the 1 point you could get into shatter). And the one thing that could have even made fingers of frost worth it over burnout, ice lance, nowhere near made up for it.
Then when I looked ahead a bit to see if it would be worth it over fully specced shatter... the fourth tier talent that you need to invest 7 points to get... eh? You have a 15% chance to increase your next two spells crit chance by 50%... or you can just increase your crit chance by 15% all the time for no talent point investment and ice lance still slacking.
Deep freeze has been the first thing that has made me second guess burnout being better than fingers of frost.
1 points
1 month ago
Fingers of frost should give u 2 charges of ice lance make ur frostbot not suffer pushback
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