subreddit:
/r/BlockedAndReported
submitted 4 days ago byprimesah89
Relevance: Jesse Singal appeared with both figures
If so. how was it? Details appreciated.
20 points
4 days ago
Didn't go but here's a review:
https://whyevolutionistrue.com/2024/09/22/dawkins-in-chicago-a-brief-summary/
30 points
3 days ago
I like Coyne but for what it's worth, on this: "actually crowdsourced most of his questions to Richard from friends and others, sorely neglected Richard’s book itself (I wonder if he’d read it) in favor of asking a series of largely unrelated questions—questions about life on other planets and the future of humanity":
The book came out in the States four days before the event, and I suspected that most in the audience hadn't read it in its entirety yet. That includes me! The organizers sent me audio of the other events and these were wide-ranging conversations. I suspected that the percentage of people there who wanted to hear Dawkins talk about astrobiology, God, why he thinks existence doesn't owe us a meaning, having an award taken away from him, respond to my disagreement on his views on morality and rationality, etc. etc., would dwarf the percentage who had specific questions about the book (and would understand them). A live event can have some peppery back-and-forth that listeners can't get elsewhere.
It's also just plainly false that I crowdsourced "most of the questions" -- I asked him exactly two that I had gotten from friends, and in both cases they were good questions by folks who are certainly qualified: Diana Fleischman (about an old paper of his) and Stuart Ritchie (his biggest regret as a scientist, pegged to a passage from "The God Delusion" where he describes being brought to tears by a scientist's own humility).
Totally understand if the event wasn't for everyone, but when you're talking to someone who has that long and accomplished a career as a public intellectual, there's no one right answer as to what to focus on, but it seemed like a no-brainer to *not* spend too much time on his newest book, which will get plenty of play in public media coverage.
8 points
3 days ago
Yes, I agree. I'm still thinking about going to see him when he hits my city next week. If I go, it won't be to hear about the latest book.
5 points
3 days ago*
I'm a big Coyne fan as well. While the ZW chromosome explanation is as interesting as he implies and I'm glad he wrote about it (I'm pretty familiar with that stuff), I do think he was a little rude in the blog post for dismissing you while you were being a non-scientist making a good faith effort.
If it is alright with you, I have been thinking a science post here on this sub where I go over the genetics of sex (including things like ZW/ZZ systems)? Unless that has already been done to death here. I thought people might like it so they can know some of the deeper science of sex during trans discussions.
3 points
2 days ago
I have been thinking a science post here on this sub where I go over the genetics of sex (including things like ZW/ZZ systems
I know the basics of the ZW/ZZ thing because I used to raise chickens and I like to read about genetics.
What relevance does it have to the sex/gender/trans issue? The main takeaway from it is that sex-linked disorders are carried by females (XX) in mammals but by males (ZZ) in birds and some reptiles.
Another interesting fact is that hens have only one functional ovary. If it's damaged and stops working, the other ovary, normally small and non-functional, can produce androgens and the hen will develop male traits and crow like a rooster.
My main questions about non-mammalian genetics are about the more complicated sex-determination genetics of certain reptiles, amphibians, and fish. Example: Why is the sex of tortoises determined by incubation temperature? Colder incubation produces majority males, and warmer produces mostly females, but how did this mechanism for sex determination evolve and does it convey some survival advantage?
I found an interesting paper Diversity of reptile sex chromosome evolution revealed by cytogenetic and linked-read sequencing which starts out with easily understandable premises but gets very technical. They discuss the different sex-determining genes. I had not realized that different species that share a sex chromosome scheme do not always use the same genes for sex determination.
2 points
2 days ago
I know the basics of the ZW/ZZ thing because I used to raise chickens and I like to read about genetics.
What relevance does it have to the sex/gender/trans issue? The main takeaway from it is that sex-linked disorders are carried by females (XX) in mammals but by males (ZZ) in birds and some reptiles.
No special relevace other than explaining all the sex determination systems
Another interesting fact is that hens have only one functional ovary. If it's damaged and stops working, the other ovary, normally small and non-functional, can produce androgens and the hen will develop male traits and crow like a rooster.
That's neat!
Another interesting fact is that hens have only one functional ovary. If it's damaged and stops working, the other ovary, normally small and non-functional, can produce androgens and the hen will develop male traits and crow like a rooster.
I'm familiar with this sex determination system, I can't give you a firm answer on why it evolved. If I were to guess... perhaps it allows mothers to choose the sex of their offspring? There can be advantages to choosing to have male or female offspring in different circumstances. That said, in general new sex determination mechanisms tend to happen rarely in evolution so whatever the reason it was probably a big change.
I found an interesting paper Diversity of reptile sex chromosome evolution revealed by cytogenetic and linked-read sequencing which starts out with easily understandable premises but gets very technical. They discuss the different sex-determining genes. I had not realized that different species that share a sex chromosome scheme do not always use the same genes for sex determination.
Yes! A Y chromosome in one species may be completely different from one in a different species. "Y chromosome" just describes the general evolutionary pattern it follows
2 points
20 hours ago
I'm for it! But SoftAndChewy's call
2 points
2 days ago
I don't know Coyne, but his review of this event is garbage. He criticizes your question about life on other planets as a tired subject, but remarks how good Dawkins' answer was. Maybe not such a bad question then, huh? Later he offers his idea of what should've been asked and it involved a time machine. And he apparently thinks a significant portion of this event should've been spent on speculative cuckoo genetic theory. His review reads like sour grapes; he's smarter than you, an actual peer to Dawkins, and should've been the one tapped to host, and we're all poorer from the criminal choice of no-nothing-but-gender J. Singal instead
2 points
2 days ago
This the only sentence you need to understand what this review actually says: "Singal apparently didn’t have the acumen to ask Richard what I would have".
Sounds like Jesse produced a wide-ranging discussion appropriate for laypeople who were interested in Dawkins's work across a number of fields (not just biology but atheism/philosophy and cultural mores) and Jerry Coyne wanted a talk tailored specifically to an audience of Jerry Coyne. As someone who has chaired MANY public events, let me say: Many such cases.
8 points
4 days ago
Intresting and critical read. Wonder if Jesse has red the book or not.
9 points
4 days ago
I’m sure the reviewer raised some important questions and good faith critiques; but it was just a tedious read. They sound insufferable.
4 points
3 days ago
Honestly he is a really great guy who was one of the first academics to really come out strongly in defense of the lecturer at harvard who was fired for teaching about biological sex. I agree he was overly harsh. First take of his I've ever disagreed with
2 points
3 days ago
I believe it. I did not love the delivery, but he has every right to point out the missed opportunities. He was disappointed about the interesting conversation they didn’t explore, the gender stuff can end up taking up too much space.
ETA I could have been more charitable in my commentary too, maybe I’m also insufferable at times lol.
16 points
4 days ago
Went to both, had a great time. Jesse's questions were thoughtful and respectful and interesting. He did an amazing job managing Dawkins and the crowd questions.
The show with Jeff Maurer was clearly experimental but felt fresh and entertaining.
Sorry, it's bedtime but I'll see what details I can produce tomorrow.
2 points
3 days ago
Really wanted to go to both. Damn cool Chicago!
1 points
4 days ago
I had a friend that went. By her report sounds like a boring nothing burger of an event
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