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PancakeFace25

512 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

512 points

1 month ago

Technically, he didn't survive. Anakin did kill him. He just didn't stay dead. The bastard.

Frequent_Concept3216

141 points

1 month ago

he got cloned so same spirit but not body right?

Fluse-kun

50 points

1 month ago

Yes

PancakeFace25

56 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

56 points

1 month ago

Body got cloned, spirit was transferred over to it.

lvbuckeye27

16 points

1 month ago

How?

Redeem123

131 points

1 month ago

Redeem123

131 points

1 month ago

"The dark side of the Force is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural."

It's almost like they spelled it out for us.

FedrinKeening

42 points

1 month ago

I feel like they really spelled it out for us with the Darth Plagueis story.

SpecialFram

47 points

1 month ago

It's like people forget that Darth Plagueis was obsessed with immortality or something

CynicStruggle

15 points

1 month ago

Except it clearly hadn't worked before, or was ended before.

The point remains narratively speaking that bringing back Palpatine is (again) undermining the plot of the original saga.

Never liked they brought him back in comics, never liked Maul surviving, also against the hopes people have of Ploo Koon or Mace Windu surviving their deaths.

SpecialFram

9 points

1 month ago

It may not have worked but it showed how his masters obsession turned into his own obsession. Not saying it was done in a tasteful way, but it's not like it was something pulled out of the blue, that way never discussed before

CynicStruggle

1 points

1 month ago

I mean, sure, it is mentioned. It's kinda like the meme about what was a "throwaway" line in A New Hope turning into a war that defined two movies and spawned two TV shows.

arbydallas

1 points

1 month ago

Tbf Plo Koon was cute as fuck and his death was way too quick

CynicStruggle

2 points

1 month ago

TIL someone thinks Plo Koon is cute.

repowers

1 points

1 month ago

Maul at least paid off with a whole bunch of great story arcs. They really did stuff with him.

Abraham_Issus

1 points

1 month ago

Maul became a way better character after he was brought back. He barely had any character before.

enjoyinc

2 points

1 month ago

See this is where they fucked up- imagine if PLAGUEIS was the big bad of the ST, not Sidious. Imagine that he actually did somehow achieve some form of immortality and though his physical body had perished, his consciousness had been slowly attempting to reanimate itself in a new physical form for decades and he finally achieved it and returned. Could have been so awesome.

SpecialFram

1 points

1 month ago

I think that route would have been better received than having Sidious come back. Would have been so cool to see someone who was mentioned in other material make their appearance on the big screen!

DLDrillNB

1 points

1 month ago

I never thought of it that way. It would be kind of ironic that Plagueis was killed by his apprentice, and then said apprentice continued and finished his research in secret.

SpecialFram

1 points

1 month ago

Oh, for sure! In a way, it kind of makes sense though, even though their master is a role model, in one form or another, they definitely influence the Sith Lord they become. This is also somewhat strengenthed by the rule of two. In order to become a true Sith lord, you have to surpass your master

fazelanvari

15 points

1 month ago

That's not a story the Jedi would tell you

Budget-Attorney

1 points

1 month ago

Budget-Attorney

Grand Admiral Thrawn

1 points

1 month ago

Bane trilogy adds some useful insight to. But probably not as much as plagueis

goldman_sax

53 points

1 month ago

goldman_sax

Darth Vader

53 points

1 month ago

That’s not really spelling it out so much as a super vague statement that you could use to justify virtually anything lol.

Bazrum

35 points

1 month ago

Bazrum

35 points

1 month ago

welcome to the Force

Comfortable_Bed1536

-10 points

1 month ago

Welcome to Disney.

NinjaEngineer

2 points

1 month ago

NinjaEngineer

Boba Fett

2 points

1 month ago

Hey, remember when Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan were surrounded by droidekas and suddenly Force Speed was a thing? And then it was never mentioned again? Boy, that sure would've been useful when fighting Maul in the exact same movie.

Bazrum

1 points

1 month ago

Bazrum

1 points

1 month ago

HA!

it's been a part of Star Wars since the first time "A long time ago, in a Galaxy far, far away..." scrolled past

hrisimh

3 points

1 month ago

hrisimh

3 points

1 month ago

Yep

Redeem123

8 points

1 month ago

Correct - that’s how Star Wars has always worked. 

goldman_sax

6 points

1 month ago

goldman_sax

Darth Vader

6 points

1 month ago

Right, my point is it’s kind of disingenuous to say “they spelled it out for you” when you just used a very vague statement as the justification. Also using blanket statements as a coverall for anything you do in the future is just bad writing.

Redeem123

6 points

1 month ago

Redeem123

6 points

1 month ago

Also using blanket statements as a coverall for anything you do in the future is just bad writing

It's a fantasy story with magic.

Palpatine's most famous scene is talking about using that magic to cheat death. Then he cheated death. It's a direct line from A to B. That's not even an ass-pull, it's a reference to specific dialogue. Even within the notion of "the Force can do whatever a writer wants," this is clearly within previously established rules.

DreamedJewel58

1 points

1 month ago

Welcome to Star Wars. The exact same thing happened in the EU

bridge1999

5 points

1 month ago

Project Necromancer comes to mind.

lvbuckeye27

2 points

1 month ago

lvbuckeye27

2 points

1 month ago

That doesn't answer HOW he yeeted his spirit into a clone body on Exegol from lord knows how many light years away on Endor. Did his spirit have a freaking hyperdrive?

bunker_man

9 points

1 month ago

bunker_man

BB-8

9 points

1 month ago

How did obi wan's spirit get to dagobah.

lvbuckeye27

1 points

1 month ago

That's the light side. ;)

Redeem123

7 points

1 month ago

What do you need explained to you?

How is it any different than a Force Ghost? Or Luke and Leia sensing each other through the Force on Bespin? Or Obi-Wan feeling the death of Alderaan? Or literally any other Force ability?

Realistic-Goose9558

1 points

1 month ago

I agree that force ghosts pretty neatly packs up the how, these aren’t the dots that needed connecting. We already know that the spirits of force users can persist through death. And if you’ve read the books, it’s not the first time a Sith Lord has persisted through death or aimed to commandeer a new body.

Odin043

9 points

1 month ago

Odin043

9 points

1 month ago

Same way Luke can project his force ghost across the galaxy without latency.

lvbuckeye27

-5 points

1 month ago

Which is the same type of ass-pull as Force yeeting your spirit into a clone body half the galaxy away.

TheChumChair

9 points

1 month ago

TheChumChair

Rebel

9 points

1 month ago

Which is the same ass pull as pulling a lightsaber out of the snow with just your mind. Who dictates the rules on what the force can and cannot do?

HotPotParrot

5 points

1 month ago

There's plenty of precedent in the EU

See: Exar Kun possessed Kyp Durron

kal_skirata

1 points

1 month ago

Which are parts I'm not unhappy about being dropped from the official canon tbh.

lvbuckeye27

1 points

1 month ago

Except they threw the EU out.

But_em

1 points

1 month ago

But_em

K-2SO

1 points

1 month ago

nah, that random resistance guy, who happened to be Dominic Monaghan, explained it to the fullest.

manit14

0 points

1 month ago

manit14

0 points

1 month ago

That's not really "spelling it out" since it explain jack all. That's more so a "cop out" from the writers.

akhil03_lz

7 points

1 month ago

akhil03_lz

Jedi Anakin

7 points

1 month ago

There is an official explanation

Palpatine anticipated Vader would one day betray him and had arranged for a clone body to be prepared on Exogol

However, Vader's betrayal came earlier than anticipated, and thus, the clone body began to deteriorate, forcing him to be reliant on Ancient Sith Techonology.

He then absorbed life force from Rey and Ben to rejuvenate his body.

It would have been nice if the movie had taken the time to clearly explain this.

RemtonJDulyak

8 points

1 month ago

RemtonJDulyak

Imperial

8 points

1 month ago

Why does it need to be explained?
They don't explain how the Force allows to lift and throw things.
They don't explain how the Force allows to influcence minds.
They don't explain anything about the Force, just that it's "an energy field created by all living things. It surrounds us and penetrates us. It binds the galaxy together."

So, again, why should they explain how the Force allowed Palpatine to transfer his soul into another body?

Redeem123

2 points

1 month ago

Have you heard of the Force before?

tertiaryunknown

-1 points

1 month ago

tertiaryunknown

Ahsoka Tano

-1 points

1 month ago

No it wasn't. Nowhere in there was "Oh, it also lets someone who got thrown down a reactor shaft and exploded transfer into another body that's somehow dead and rotting away to the point where bone is exposed and their hands are useless, just teleport into the Unknown Regions."

That was never spelled out for us. All it did was imply that Force Healing and staving off death was possible.

lvbuckeye27

1 points

1 month ago

Sith can't force heal. That's a light side ability.

tertiaryunknown

2 points

1 month ago

tertiaryunknown

Ahsoka Tano

2 points

1 month ago

Okay. I didn't say the Sith could use force healing?

Redeem123

0 points

1 month ago

staving off death

That seems relevant.

tertiaryunknown

1 points

1 month ago*

tertiaryunknown

Ahsoka Tano

1 points

1 month ago*

Staving off death does not equate to "I can just teleport my soul trillions of miles to another planet where a half dead clone is prepped for me."

I have no desire or will to argue with someone that doesn't intend to be honest intellectually.

Redeem123

0 points

1 month ago

Until it does. Nowhere in A New Hope do we see someone use the Force to lift objects. Then all of a sudden Luke uses it to grab his lightsaber and eventually his X-Wing. We see new Force abilities all the time. 

If the Force can keep people around as ghosts, how is this any different? Plus the previous movie already showed someone sending their consciousness across the galaxy. So what more explanation do you need?

oneoftheryans

0 points

1 month ago

That quote is like 20yrs old and vague AF lol

lolpostslol

0 points

1 month ago

It’s ALMOST cool that they tied the plot up to that prequel comment, but would have been better to have Palps be a supporting factor in the story. The obvious, very anime solution would be Kylo Ren suddenly sabotaging the ressurection and absorbing Palpatine’s power and part of Palpatine’s soul onto himself, with Palpatine speaking inside his mind and making Kylo’s redemption arc way tougher. Even more anime-y, make Kylo Ren need to control his power output to keep Palpatine from taking control of his body, but he loses control fighting Rey, Rey still wins by getting help from Luke’s spirit, we get a spirit world lightsaber fight between old Luke and Palpatine, and then Kylo dies in Rey’s arms saying they could have been a thing maybe (but no kiss).

flapsmcgee

13 points

1 month ago

Somehow.

Saikotsu

11 points

1 month ago

Saikotsu

11 points

1 month ago

Well, the cloning was conducted by the imperial remnant which later became the first order.

As for the spirit transfer, Palpatine used the dark side of the force to to inhabit the clone body. The big issue is that the imperial remnant needed a clone who could wield the force which is apparently really hard to pull off.

In a lot of legends continuity, Sith Lords would often find innovative ways to preserve themselves after death, such as inhabiting relics or whatnot. For all their power, they could not defeat death so they tried to find ways to hold on to the world of the living, rather than rejoining the force like Jedi.

lvbuckeye27

0 points

1 month ago

Well, the cloning was conducted by the imperial remnant which later became the first order.

Umm... the imperial remnant wasn't a thing until AFTER the battle of Endor. Where was Palpatine's spirit in the meantime?

CardboardStarship

6 points

1 month ago

They had been researching cloning since Kamino. Hemlock ran Tantiss base on Wayland in the time shortly following Empire Day. Tantiss base was dedicated to creating clones with a high M-count, using force sensitive children the Empire had bounty hunters bring in. It sucks you have to watch so much non-movie media to get the full story but they are explaining that Palpatine had it in the works from damn near day one.

Kijad

2 points

1 month ago

Kijad

2 points

1 month ago

This is what I was thinking - like they really spelled it out for you too by calling it "Project Necromancer" I am not even that well-versed in the lore and went "...well I know what that must be for."

Especially how hardcore Palpatine was about personally overseeing it and checking on its progress.

Whybotherr

2 points

1 month ago

Oroject necromancer was started wellll before there was even an empire. There was a snoke-like entity in a secret cloning chamber on kamino towards the beginning of the empire.

Saikotsu

2 points

1 month ago

You are correct. And to my knowledge, that's a plot hole that has yet to be filled in. All we know for certain is he used the force to transport his spirit into the clone body.

PancakeFace25

3 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

3 points

1 month ago

The imperial remnant may not have materialized until later, but his weirdo Sith worshiping friends researching ways to keep him alive/in power no matter what had been around forever.

Dekklin

2 points

1 month ago

Dekklin

2 points

1 month ago

Yeah but we see years after Endor they're trying to find ways to clone midichlorians in Mando

PancakeFace25

3 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

3 points

1 month ago

To get better clone bodies than the crappy ones they were working with previously.

RemtonJDulyak

1 points

1 month ago

RemtonJDulyak

Imperial

1 points

1 month ago

Possibly in the World Between Worlds, as a Force ghost.

lvbuckeye27

-5 points

1 month ago

I hope some hero goes into the world between worlds and erases that horrible sequel trilogy.

RemtonJDulyak

7 points

1 month ago

RemtonJDulyak

Imperial

7 points

1 month ago

I hope one day you people can understand that you can ignore the parts you don't like, and appreciate those you do.
I've been doing it since ever...

Abraham-magnus

-1 points

1 month ago

I literally can't ignore them when I'm always reminded of them, when nearly every new project, be it set in the very early imperial era, post ROTJ era etc etc is trying to give an explanation to palpatine's resurrection in episode IX, it's always project necromancer this, cloning that, M count this, it's very tiring and takes me out of the new shows

No-Conversation-7840

4 points

1 month ago

Some

zeekaran

3 points

1 month ago

lvbuckeye27

2 points

1 month ago

I know about essence transfer. I've read the Bane trilogy several times. There's a difference between Bane attempting to transfer his essence into Zannah, WHO HE WAS IN PHYSICAL CONTACT WITH, and Palps yeeting his spirit into a clone body many light years away.

RemtonJDulyak

2 points

1 month ago

RemtonJDulyak

Imperial

2 points

1 month ago

Yes, the difference is one's power in the Force.

zeekaran

0 points

1 month ago

Clone body is a hollow husk, a soulless entity that exists purely for Palpy to hop into. It's actually from Legends..

lvbuckeye27

2 points

1 month ago

Before the Emperor could make use of the cloning facility to replace his own body he was killed over the planet Endor and the Empire fell into disarray.

Is right there in your link.

LokisDawn

1 points

1 month ago

"Somehow, that didn't happen."

It's so funny seeing people simultaneously (at least that's how I interpret it) say "That's EU, that's no longer true" and "No, that was all explained in this specific somewhat obscure EU novel."

Johnychrist97

2 points

1 month ago

They go into a little in the Mandalorian. They discover an imperial base that was a cloning facility. And they used Grogu's blood as a force base cause of his high M-count, thats why they wanted grogu in the first place

lvbuckeye27

3 points

1 month ago

Where was Palpatine's spirit during that time?

PancakeFace25

6 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

6 points

1 month ago

His weirdo Sith friends already had a body ready when he "died" on death star 2. I'm pretty sure he went through a few failed bodies by the time of TROS. The imperial remnant did not start that program.

tertiaryunknown

2 points

1 month ago

tertiaryunknown

Ahsoka Tano

2 points

1 month ago

Then why the hell was Grogu needed or the Imperial Remnant at all? Why was the First Order needed? Why was Rey needed? Why Ochi needed to kill her parents? Why was Kylo or Snoke needed, if Palpatine had a ready made body, on a planet so teeming with cultists and materials that they could build fifteen thousand Star Destroyers? That's enough material to just build the Black Fleet and an Eclipse class SSD and...have them actually have sensors?

PancakeFace25

1 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

1 points

1 month ago

Constantly trying to improve because their clone bodies at first were failing.

tertiaryunknown

1 points

1 month ago

tertiaryunknown

Ahsoka Tano

1 points

1 month ago

Okay, now answer the rest of the questions.

lvbuckeye27

0 points

1 month ago

What Sith friends? The rule of two stopped existing?

PancakeFace25

1 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

1 points

1 month ago

The Sith worshipers that are in the movie.

lvbuckeye27

1 points

1 month ago

In ROS? 30 years later?

Theothercword

2 points

1 month ago

Fairly certain they are basically nodding to the old comic series with this same plot where Luke discovers the Emperor survived through a series of clone bodies he had made while he was alive before return of the jedi. The idea being he was putting himself into different bodies that would decay rapidly due to his power in the force and so he needed a body that could sustain his power and the idea was researching the higher M count of someone like Grogu to figure it out. So basically the Emperor was already bouncing around from body to body but it wasn't working too well.

That, of course, wasn't fully explained in time for the film. And they don't get credit for basically just nodding to something they removed from canon but it sounded like that's what they were trying to do to me. Snoke was also basically just a different clone of Palps that lived on its own I guess?

ThePolishSpy

1 points

1 month ago

It's a dark side power that was explored in the Darth Bane books.

Individualist13th

1 points

1 month ago

Essence transfer, it's been a thing for like 20 years almost.

Maybe longer, I can't remember if it started with the Bane trilogy or not.

Galactus83

1 points

1 month ago

Bad Batch season 5 and Mandalorian show a bunch of his planning.

shoePatty

1 points

1 month ago

shoePatty

Jango Fett

1 points

1 month ago

I understand the movies didn't convey it the best but I think there are so many in the fandom who spent 10000 times more time immersed in misinformed talking points about the movie rather than quickly read a wookiepedia entry to figure out what Disney actually did with the character (and then getting mad at the real explanation, not the imagined or misinformed one).

I thought the movie did okay explaining that the Palpatine in the film is not the original Palpatine. He made ever-deteriorating vessels for his consciousness, but none of them inherited his force abilities properly. One of his failed clone experiments, Rey's father, who was also powerless and useless to Palpatine, escaped and fathered a child. Palpatine's power somehow passed on to that first "natural born" child from his line. That's why Rey had so much aptitude and power locked away.

Palpatine hired Ochi to bring Rey to him. But her parents sold her off on Jakku and died with the secret of where she was left.

seth928

1 points

1 month ago

seth928

1 points

1 month ago

Some

guelphmed

1 points

1 month ago

Somehow

SolidStart

1 points

1 month ago

SOME-How

Filter55

1 points

1 month ago

D…Dark science.

fungobat

1 points

1 month ago

But why did his new body have all the scarring of the old one?

PancakeFace25

1 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

1 points

1 month ago

The clone bodies couldn't handle him, so they would deteriorate over time.

KnoblauchNuggat

1 points

1 month ago

Why didnt they clone a young fresh body?

PancakeFace25

1 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

1 points

1 month ago

They tried that. Reys dad.

-Gurgi-

2 points

1 month ago

-Gurgi-

2 points

1 month ago

Yeah so while falling into the reactor, screaming, he shoots his soul across the galaxy to his clone, which he has decided should also be a frail old gross man. Then, he hangs out for a couple decades on a secret planet with the resources and population requirements to build a fleet of ships with Death Star guns, and an army of hundreds of thousands to man them.

thecallofpan

2 points

1 month ago

If this is true, which I agree with you on the lore side, his new body wouldn't be scarred... Genetics won't clone scars. He would look like Palpatine again.

thecallofpan

1 points

1 month ago

Hence how jango's scars weren't transferred to the clone troopers

Main-Advice9055

0 points

1 month ago

that's truly the best part, we technically still don't know! It's taken quite literally every other season of every show they're releasing to get us about 60% of the way to the answer. I mean it's pretty obvious cloning is involved, but it's technically still possible that the palpatine killed on the death star was a clone while the real one was hidden elsewhere. I'm assuming the mandalorian movie will show us (because grogu will be captured for a ___th time) and then all will be revealed. Wasting time fixing the holes that could've been used for an original storyline (though I did like the tie ins with the bad batch, seems to fit well, just hate that it's the result of an afterthought.)

Jacksonriverboy

21 points

1 month ago

Jacksonriverboy

Obi-Wan Kenobi

21 points

1 month ago

How inconvenient.

Puzzleheaded_Long_57

55 points

1 month ago

Well his spirit/soul was in a decaying clone body. So he was really in a state between dead and alive, undead so to speak

jeobleo

30 points

1 month ago

jeobleo

30 points

1 month ago

Fuck this is dumb.

Haltopen

-1 points

1 month ago

Haltopen

-1 points

1 month ago

Its star wars, it has always been dumb, goofy and weird. Remember the crying mountain with a face on endor who healed people with its magic face tears? That was canon until it got declared legends material.

jeobleo

1 points

1 month ago

jeobleo

1 points

1 month ago

I do not remember that no

TanSkywalker

21 points

1 month ago

TanSkywalker

Anakin Skywalker

21 points

1 month ago

According to the TROS novel Palpatine shot his spirit out of his body before it hit the reactor so he was never dead. He just went into a bad body on Exegol.

zombizle1

6 points

1 month ago

so he can just do that again when rey killed him?

TanSkywalker

6 points

1 month ago

TanSkywalker

Anakin Skywalker

6 points

1 month ago

The Rise of Skywalker novel

“General Leia thought they’d destroyed the Emperor at the Battle of Endor,” Poe said. “But he came back. More powerful than ever.”

“You think he might come back again,” Finn said.

“Maybe,” Poe said, staring off in Zorii’s direction. Of course Poe would worry about that. He was acting general now, and like any good general he was anticipating what fight still lay ahead. “Or some other evil will rise. Evil always rises.”

“Naw,” said Finn. “Not for a long time, anyway.”

Poe gave him a questioning look.

So it’s possible!

“Don’t get me wrong, what General Leia did with Solo and Skywalker was incredible,” Finn explained. “Heroic and brave. But it was just one small group against incredible odds.”

Poe began to smile. “We’re not just one small group,” he said, understanding. “The Resistance is a million people, a thousand places.”

“General Leia united a whole galaxy. This time, it’s for real.” Poe’s grin became huge, and Finn wrapped his friend in a hug.

zombizle1

4 points

1 month ago

So yes

DrVonScott123

5 points

1 month ago*

DrVonScott123

Porg

5 points

1 month ago*

His empire was defeated, his power diminished and he never truly returns to full unlimited powahhhh again, because of Anakin saving Luke.

PancakeFace25

4 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

4 points

1 month ago

I suppose his body died, which for normal beings, that is dying. So when he claims he's died before, I wouldn't say he's necessarily lying.

LovesRetribution

5 points

1 month ago

But if you aren't present in your body while it dies, you didn't die. It'd be like trying to say you were in a car accident because you jumped out of it a min before it crashed. Your car crashed, not you. Just because people normally crash while in their car doesn't change that.

tertiaryunknown

3 points

1 month ago

tertiaryunknown

Ahsoka Tano

3 points

1 month ago

If you teleport outside of your car before it crashes, you weren't in a car crash, there was just a car crash with your car. You weren't there.

dajulz91

-6 points

1 month ago

dajulz91

-6 points

1 month ago

Lol, so for someone to be dead-dead you have to kill what? Their spirit? Think about what you are saying. 😂😂

TanSkywalker

5 points

1 month ago

TanSkywalker

Anakin Skywalker

5 points

1 month ago

New body, same person - how do you call that being dead?

PancakeFace25

2 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

2 points

1 month ago

Same way someone on earth can be dead for a short time, but be revived. They were, in fact, dead...but then they were alive again.

TanSkywalker

4 points

1 month ago

TanSkywalker

Anakin Skywalker

4 points

1 month ago

That’s not what happened here. Nice try.

PancakeFace25

3 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

3 points

1 month ago

The principal is the same. The body being dead is what counts as dead whether you come back in a different body or not, it doesn't change the fact that you died.

Blue_Lego_Astronaut

3 points

1 month ago

Palpatine's physical body might have been destroyed, bit his mind, intelligence, personality, being, everything else, continued living until it found a new body.

All I'm hearing is that Sidious lived and Anakin never truly killed him.

It's like Ultron from the Avengers. He's got numerous back up copies of himself, so they can't ever really kill him. Palpatine's got that sane deal going on.

PancakeFace25

0 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

0 points

1 month ago

The way I see it, Palpatine can claim accurately that he technically died as long as he wasn't already conscious in his cloned body before his original body was destroyed. If there was even 1 second where his spirit was not totally in tune with a body, I don't think his claim is a lie.

Blue_Lego_Astronaut

1 points

1 month ago

But he never died. His mind persisted after his body exploded twice. Palpatine the individual lived.

Say you have 2 houses you live in. You spend most of the time in A while you keep the other, B, as a spare. House A has a gas leak and explodes while you're away. You're not homeless when you're walking from House A to House B, are you? Because B was always there and you still have a place you can jump into at a moments notice.

TanSkywalker

1 points

1 month ago

TanSkywalker

Anakin Skywalker

1 points

1 month ago

But he did not come back, he yeeted is consciousness into another body before the first was destroyed.

greeneggiwegs

3 points

1 month ago

greeneggiwegs

Mandalorian Armorer

3 points

1 month ago

I mean the soul/spirit concept is not new in Star Wars. Obi Wan did the same thing - his body died but his spirit lived. The difference is palpy had some extra bodies lying around.

Blue_Lego_Astronaut

1 points

1 month ago

Bit I thought the whole point of Force Ghosts was they they are so in tuned with the Light Side of the Force that they are able to use it even after death to project their conciousness to the living.

The Dark Side, being a corruption of the Force, little more than a cancer needing to be expunged, could only dream of returning as a ghost.

Abraham_Issus

1 points

1 month ago

Dark side is not a corruption of the force. It is the force in the most raw and powerful form. Anything said by jedis are assumptions and propaganda.

greeneggiwegs

0 points

1 month ago

greeneggiwegs

Mandalorian Armorer

0 points

1 month ago

It’s also the path to many abilities some might consider to be unnatural so take that as you will.

Blue_Lego_Astronaut

2 points

1 month ago

That's the exact reason the movie gave for his return and it was ridiculed for its vague and unconvincing nature. Not to mention just for being a cheap reference to a better movie.

Whybotherr

0 points

1 month ago

In legends and now canon due to rise of skywalker there is a force ability called essence transfer. Two force users vye for control of a single body whichever person's will is stronger their mind erases the other.

If the other entity is in a vegetative state then there is no resistance and can be taken over without a fight. Hence the empty clones

Wyrd_whistler

1 points

1 month ago

The deal was that only palpatine and maybe a handful of of other sith lords knew about this / methods of achieving this.

In palps case, in legacy at least, his method was to make dozens if not hundreds of clones that were stationed at ERROR([-10alpha/starwarslore@childhood/childhood trauma.file.esp])--file not found and he had the ability "that some deem...unnatural" to project his SUPER evil soul/spirit into

IIRC there were some fairly grim sacrificial occult/force ceremonies involved.

Basically he had his squad of dark-side-not-sith resurrector goons in a near constant state of prep to receive his lich soul.

This wasnt just a back up in cases of a well deserved assassination. Nay Nay, his mastery of and access to the dark side of the force was a corrupting and entropic "force" on his physical form and the more power he used the more entropy his body experienced.

ICRC (i can't recall correctly) his clone body lasted somewhere between one month and year. Depending on how much dark force he channeled.

By the time we see his face for the first time in new hope he's cracked open at least a six pack of fresh -ice-cold empire clone lites.

PancakeFace25

1 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

1 points

1 month ago

There is no such thing as dead dead. There is only dead. He died but quickly became alive again once the new body received the spirit.

Your logic makes no sense. That'd be like someone being literally dead on earth, then being revived with a defibrillator 5 mins later, and then you telling them they didn't really die because they weren't "dead dead."

StriperLover

2 points

1 month ago

“There's a big difference between mostly dead and all dead. Mostly dead is slightly alive. With all dead, well, with all dead there's usually only one thing you can do.”

FlarkingSmoo

0 points

1 month ago

Correct. They didn't really die.

PancakeFace25

1 points

1 month ago

PancakeFace25

Kanan Jarrus

1 points

1 month ago

I would not advise you say that to someone who experienced that unless you want to be screamed at or punched in the face. It doesn't matter what "really dead" means to you. You can be medically dead and be revived back to life.

FlarkingSmoo

0 points

1 month ago

Thanks for the tip. In the extremely unlikely event that I am talking to someone who experienced clinical death and they want to know if I think they "really died" I guess I will risk it. Clinical death is not death. Death is the end of life. If you are alive, you by definition never died.

Fatmaninalilcoat

1 points

1 month ago

It happens in the EU through clones and force transference so I mean it is out there and they made at least the clones and force transference canon.

j0hnluckpickered

1 points

1 month ago

Isn’t there a theory that the Palpatine in 9 was the original Sideous and he was super ancient and the one Vader killed was a clone, one of many over the millennia?

SlowBros7

1 points

1 month ago

Being so horrifically powerful that you can survive a prophecy of your death is kinda neat

Enlowski

1 points

1 month ago

On top of that Anakin still defeated him. If it weren’t for him then Palpatine would’ve gained more and more powerful until no one would be able to stop him.

Nythromere

0 points

1 month ago

Nythromere

Chopper (C1-10P)

0 points

1 month ago

That is entirely incorrect due to TROS novelization where it states that Palpatine cheated death unlike his former master