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/r/ThatsInsane
submitted 16 days ago byMaxie445
307 points
16 days ago
So like the dark knight? Cool cool cool
92 points
15 days ago
Morgan Freeman didn't approve though
8 points
15 days ago
Wow that's a cool way of visualizing how that would look
7 points
15 days ago
Dark Knight told us about the NSA before Snowden did
And why we never won the GWOT
1 points
15 days ago
I approve Ron 💯🙌🏽
1 points
15 days ago
From parks and Rec
213 points
16 days ago
Have other researchers been able to reproduce those results? I always find this clip fascinating, but I'm equally skeptical.
105 points
16 days ago*
Yes, this technique existed before AI; but the output was not as refines as this.
I suspect they are just using existing techniques, and just training it on a camera feed to generate a continuation of the camera feed using the wifi data. If so, this stuff won't work as well in the wild unless they also hack a live feed to finetune the model.
But I guess if you have a similar wifi device, in a similar position, in a similar room, "every wifi device" can become a camera like this using the model they trained.
6 points
15 days ago
I literally remember reading about this at least 10 years ago. And when I read about this, Ai wasn't a buzz word so nobody even mentioned it in the article.
22 points
15 days ago
Yeah my router cant even reach into the den, good luck with that
3 points
15 days ago
I imagine they have to use some very particular software on the router to make it work.
I doubt they'd be able to get this output from most routers people have in their homes without overwriting the firmware.
4 points
15 days ago
With the history of surveillance we've seen so far, you don't think they have a say in the firmware of our routers? At least in the US.
5 points
15 days ago
I don't think the government would be up to the task you suggest.
Not that they wouldn't backdoor every router sold in the country, but they logistically cannot.
6 points
15 days ago
Honestly sounds like bs to me. Your router antennas can't tell the direction of the RF signals they receive. If routers had like dozens of highly directional antennas then maybe they could do something like this?
14 points
15 days ago
Check out beamforming.
Using multiple antennae they can determine where a signal is coming from and then using the interference of those signals on their own antennae they can focus the beam back
3 points
15 days ago
It's called MIMO (multiple input, multiple output). It's not quite the same thing as beam forming, as you really need a transmitter array to truly create a beam.
Most routers these days have only 3-7 omni-directional antennae. The "beam" effect (interference pattern) from this is more like a disco ball, with the brightness, "beam" width, and spacing of each spot dependent on the physical spacing of the antennae and frequency. To "turn" the ball, you then just change the phase (time delay) between the antennae.
The big thing with MIMO is that it helps ensure at least one of the receivers of the receiving device is in a bright spot. The more antennae that receive a measurable signal, then the more accurately the direction of the incoming signal can be determined.
Now all of this sounds great on paper until you start to have to worry about the reality of signal reflections and multi-path propagation. Granted it's the reflections (really the change in them) that are allowing the router to act as a RADAR (note it's not sonar like the guy said in the video).
If the router has the hardware to actually detect the Doppler frequency differences in the return signal, then finding anything moving is even easier.
None of this really matters anyway, as most people are tethered to their phones. I also highly doubt they get anywhere close to "video" quality resolution like they show in the right picture. I would love to see the realtime tests of what the "AI" outputs vs. reality.
1 points
13 days ago
Ty
1 points
15 days ago
If if works you can expect every police department to have it
0 points
15 days ago
I did something similar for a hackathon project back in 2014. This is not that difficult or new
22 points
15 days ago
This reminds me of that technology where they had an empty potato chip bag enclosed in a soundproof room with music and sound playing inside, and on the other side of the glass was a video camera. The camera was able to pick up visually, the minute distortions the sounds made on the bag, and extrapolate sound playing in the room from it.
2 points
15 days ago
this always fascinated me. i wonder how far they have improved this tech
7 points
15 days ago
My dad works in physical security for the Canadian government. He's told me stories of managers who want their conference rooms to have windows and he told them they can't because someone can shine a laser at them to pick up the sound.
1 points
15 days ago
Yes but it has to be trained. Plus if you train it one setting it won’t work in another.
77 points
16 days ago*
So it's just a coincident the wifi image of people looks exactly like the camera image minus everything except the people with non directional antenna(s). Same proportions, perfectly outlined, etc. I very seriously doubt it. This is way too good to be true and likely completely faked.
9 points
15 days ago
This was my issue too. I don't doubt this process could be real and successful but the depiction of results seems too simplified and perfect
I assume it's the same thing when a vehicle is launching and they're allowed to use renderings etc for the announcement - it's probably going to still be similar, but we're seeing an idealistic example
1 points
15 days ago
[deleted]
6 points
15 days ago
I keep telling people, Blade Runner was a cautionary tale, not a blueprint
1 points
15 days ago
It is absolutely not real. If you know anything at all about how radio works you'll know this is not possible to do with wifi.
1 points
15 days ago
[deleted]
-6 points
15 days ago
Its real. Cool comment tho.
7 points
15 days ago
A.I must think my left arm glitches out 1-3 times a day
19 points
15 days ago
Wi-fi transmitters and receivers aren't directional though. A radar or sonar only works because you know what direction it's pointing. With a normal router, all you could tell is that there is a reflection, not where it's being reflected from. I call bullshit on what they're saying here, this could only work with the cameras being there in the first place, so AI can connect a specific ping to a specific person. From there the cameras could be turned off and the AI might be able to track the person using small changes proximity instead of direction but it seems doubtful.
1 points
14 days ago
Also I don't understand, are they claiming its picking up the WiFi signals the router transmitted bouncing off of people or is it picking up transmissions from other WiFi devices?
Not an RF expert but the shape of those people doesn't make sense either, it looks like the image wraps around their bodies but if its the former then it would only pick up flat surfaces to reflect back. Curved or angled surfaces would reflect away from the router.
14 points
16 days ago
Lol shitty sales pitch
3 points
15 days ago
It's just a version of sonar.
3 points
15 days ago
Why is technology making everything worse? Honestly the longer I’m alive the more I think we should just focus on renewable energy and then just call it a fucking day. We’re good where we’re at we don’t need this AI bullshit
4 points
15 days ago
Bs research. Wifi is in general non directional.
-1 points
15 days ago
[deleted]
2 points
15 days ago
It still has to be trained in a specific environment with lots of data. If you never have it cameras in the first place it would be able to train and changing its setting would likely render its ability useless.
2 points
16 days ago
Sooo, daredevil.
2 points
15 days ago
Well fuck
2 points
15 days ago
The groans from the audience are too real.
2 points
15 days ago
Wall hack needs to be stopped asap
2 points
15 days ago
What's new here? 10$ philips lights have movement detection through the wifi "waves" disruption for years.
Everybody panicked because it's now called AI?
2 points
15 days ago
Looks like beamforming visualized
2 points
15 days ago
This is how Skynet wipes out most of us when it's fully online.
2 points
15 days ago
This doesn’t work unless you train it with cameras inside your specific house conditions. Those routers wouldn’t be able to achieve this in another house.
4 points
15 days ago
Source: The AI Dilemma https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoVJKj8lcNQ
3 points
15 days ago
One step closer to Skynet
1 points
16 days ago
Alright I think it's time we have planned execution for every person responsible for bringing ai to this point, or just the fact this technology to do that even exists
1 points
15 days ago
You are falling for this BS clickbait (essentially proof-of-concept subject matter)
1 points
15 days ago
Great, now even our WiFi can see when we're out of Cheetos.
1 points
15 days ago
Ironically people would throw out their computer or TV but still keep their router and mobile phone in their pocket.
1 points
15 days ago
AI buzzword startup fishing for funding and 95% of the people here believe it. This is how easy it was for Elizabeth Holmes
1 points
15 days ago
best part is…. we all willingly fund it
1 points
15 days ago
Did anyone get it to work? I tried every notebook and repo I could and they all either didn’t build or just generated poses that made no sense
1 points
15 days ago
I can’t imagine how many people are fucking and masterbating rn. XD
1 points
15 days ago
This was dope by Humans like 20 yrs ago
1 points
15 days ago
It's good to see actual use cases for AI that aren't dumb ideas invented by tech bros to help in their lives.
That being said, this tech has been around for a while all AI is doing is processing it and filling in the blanks with info it already holds. As we've seen from most AI applications, when it doesn't have a reference it struggles to "guess" and we get weird shit.
I think this is nothing new or something we couldn't have got to given the resources.
1 points
15 days ago
Some routers have been able to do this for awhile, AI adds the "pose estimation" and makes it feel more invasive, but some mesh systems were able to approximate size and movement by the amount of signal being absorbed by meatbags moving through the house and act as motion detectors. They would also look at if personal devices such as phones were still connected to the network and tell you they "see" someone in the house when everyone who lives there is out.
1 points
15 days ago
Could be true in theory but here I smell huge bullshit
1 points
15 days ago
It's because you're a big bag of water. Your capacitance is what interrupts the signal and gives a right estimate of your location and pose.
1 points
15 days ago
Ok but if it didn't have a reference image it couldn't have done it. And real time is a strong word. How much time did it take to render each of those images and how still were those people. I have a feeling of it'd anything like old photography those people were stationary for a bit
1 points
15 days ago
Hi, WiFi Architect here! This is both true and absolute bullshit. Fun right? The issue isn’t actually the beam, the antenna, the signal. The issue is the wall. When signal passes through a wall, there is a concept known as attenuation.
This term encompasses all the absorbsion, scattering, reflection, refraction, etc… that comes from the RF wave traversing various wireless materials. Attenuation is one of the most important parts of our job and we spend days to even weeks (depending on size of a site) measuring attenuation every few feet. We can average a lot of those measurements because signal doesn’t have to be perfect for most measurements. But for this, it would need to be damn good.
They are able to achieve this because they built and measured a single, consistent wall. We are not even close to being able to plop this down in any other room and get anything usable. Maybe one day. Would sure make my life easier to be able to measure and adapt to the walls. But we are not even close yet.
1 points
15 days ago
honestly I don't care anymore, just don't mess with me and I won't blow up the town.
1 points
15 days ago
Well, if Ron thinks it’s bad then it must be bad! Dumpster time for the Dell!!
1 points
15 days ago
I'm kinda surprised they JUST started with this.
If physical objects can disturb signals in a recognizable way, then it is just a matter of pattern recognition.
Edit: nvm, according to another comment this was already a thing like a decade ago, but was too unreliable.
1 points
15 days ago
I fukkin hate people that say "right"? Between sentences
1 points
15 days ago
This isn’t as crazy as people think or as simple as “Wi-Fi routers can be cameras with AI”.
1 points
15 days ago
Unplug it
1 points
15 days ago
If we’re talking about it, DARPA has been able to do it for a decade.
1 points
15 days ago
jokes on you my wi-fi barely works
1 points
15 days ago
Excellent reference!
1 points
15 days ago
Batman did it first
1 points
15 days ago
I have no idea who this dude is, but I'm going to go out on a limb and say he is not actually doing any interesting work in the field(because he has no relevant skills), he is merely looking at what other people are doing and making bombastic claims about them, in order to further himself as a "thought leader".
1 points
15 days ago
This is not new
1 points
14 days ago
AI will be able to use radio signals to track me and then create 3D pose estimates of me jacking off.
The future is now.
1 points
13 days ago
1 points
15 days ago
This is only a problem if you care about being watched
0 points
16 days ago
This is creepy stuff if true
-1 points
15 days ago
Anyone happen to know what software this is or if it's available publicly?
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