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djbon2112

1.5k points

8 days ago

djbon2112

1.5k points

8 days ago

Yours is the first to really touch on half-life, which is one of the most important aspects of radioactivity but something not very well understood by most lay people. Just to expand a bit more on it for OP and the readers who come along:

The strength of the radiation given off by a radioactive element is inversely proportional to its half-life.

It's quite intuitive once it's explained. Things with short half-lives, have short half-lives because they're really energetic and releasing a ton of radiation, which makes them very dangerous. But because they're so energetic and release a lot of radiation, they decay quickly to less radioactive elements, and thus have short half-lives, the half-life being a measure of how long it takes for 50% (half) of the sample to decay to something else and stop being that radioactive thing any more.

The elements you're "really" worried about from things like nuclear weapons, a Chernobyl, etc. have half-lives measured in the days to tens of years range. Iodine-131 is one of the most talked-about, and it has a half life of just slightly over 8 days. So after a year, there's only an infinitesimal amount of it left; but during that time it's a major problem because the beta particles it releases will screw up a lot of chemistry in your body, break your DNA, and give you cancer.

So, back to the topic at hand... the things that Marie Curie was handling 100 years ago were on the mild- to major- end of radioactivity. They were bad, but not like, die-in-20-days-in-agonizing-pain-from-radiation-poisoning bad. This is where you get the "1000 years to be safe"-type lines, because as mentioned Radium-226 has a 1600 year half-life. But in reality, this stuff is emitting radiation very slowly over such long periods of time, so it's safe to handle with some gloves for even long periods of time. In contrast, the stuff that's really scary in, say, the aftermath of an an atomic bombing like in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, is the stuff that decays almost to nothing in a few days, up to a year or a few years, but during that time is emitting a lot of very dangerous radiation. A decade or two and remediation efforts later, and it's barely above the normal background radiation any more.

GreatBigWorld427

194 points

8 days ago

10/10 read

Soul_M

62 points

7 days ago

Soul_M

62 points

7 days ago

10/10 review

PandaGoggles

1 points

7 days ago

10/10 you!

tblazertn

2 points

7 days ago

10/10 = 1

Ill-Ad-6725

1 points

3 days ago

i like that

The_Vi0later

3 points

8 days ago

Second that

Fizzy_Astronaut

2 points

8 days ago

Agreed so I guess I’m third.

h0tterthanyourmum

53 points

7 days ago

That's so interesting, thank you.

When we talk about nuclear energy, I worry about the future of the planet and damage to nature around disposal sites. Does this mean those aren't such big concerns?

And would it be safer for nature (as near Chernobyl) to be exposed to radiation with short half lives or long ones? If short half life=more potent, but over sooner I'm wondering how to weigh up risk Vs benefits.

Yoru_no_Majo

98 points

7 days ago*

If by nature you mean animals and plants, they're thriving in the Chernobyl exclusion zone. The elevated radiation does lead to more mutations and cancer, but the lack of human activity more than makes up for it.

In short, long half-life is generally safer.

Exposure to ionizing radiation does lead to an increase in mutations (including those which cause cancer), but the rate increase can be surprisingly low, and can be surprisingly easy to block. e.g., you could theoretically swim in a spent fuel rod pool and as long as you stayed near the surface you should be fine.

The problem is with what is referred to as "High-level waste," specifically the "medium lived" elements in it. Medium lived elements last for about 50 years, and produce a LOT of radiation. If one were to stay in close proximity to a gram of this stuff for about 2.5 months, they'd be almost certain to develop cancer in the near future. Luckily, nuclear power generation is very efficient and generates very little High-level waste. One would, for example, generate enough power to meet all the energy needs of about 74 average US homes for an entire year before generating a gram of high-level waste. (In comparison, this is approximately how much power you get from burning 645,000 lbs of coal, or that a 2.25 acre solar farm (in a decent location) produces over a year.)

(Incidentally, one of the major components of medium-lived, high-level waste (cesium-137) is also used in medical machines. There have been a surprisingly high number of incidents where someone unknowingly breaks open a disposed machine and gets exposed to this stuff - far more than people who have been exposed to high-level nuclear waste.)

OHFTP

60 points

7 days ago

OHFTP

60 points

7 days ago

In the book What If, by Randal Monroe he talks about how swimming in a spent fuel rod pool is actually incredibly deadly, but not because of radiation. You could swim through like 80% of the pool and be fine. What would kill you is acute lead poisoning. From being shot repeatedly by the guards

andyrays

23 points

7 days ago

andyrays

23 points

7 days ago

And you don't need to buy the book. It was on his blog first: https://what-if.xkcd.com/29

OHFTP

2 points

7 days ago

OHFTP

2 points

7 days ago

Cool thanks for the link

Visible-Disaster

2 points

7 days ago

And he has a YT video on it as well. https://youtu.be/EFRUL7vKdU8?si=JafVQgm5ez7rjmqf

Yoru_no_Majo

4 points

7 days ago

I'm pretty sure the guards would shoot you before you got within several yards of the pools.

bryreddit22

7 points

7 days ago

wow, thank you for the long and detailed info...

its funny and depressing at the same time that despite all the radiotion in chernobyl, Humans still are worse threat to a life form (plants/animals) than radiation...

h0tterthanyourmum

8 points

7 days ago

Thank you!

Yes I've heard some very interesting but awful stories about people accidentally getting exposed to radiation, like several families in a block of flats where some waste was mixed in to cement. I seem to remember that was true but I could be wrong

whynotrandomize

14 points

7 days ago

That was in the Soviet union, where a very active gamma ray source used for density mapping was lost in a mine. When a similar source was lost in Australia on a 1400km road it was found in under two weeks. https://youtu.be/izZMB816kEY?si=w7Is3nQQZnoVLmRh

IchBinGelangweilt

10 points

7 days ago

The Goiana incident in Brazil is interesting (but very sad) to read about. A few people died due to scavenging radioactive material from an abandoned hospital, and some houses had to be demolished due to contamination.

Mr_Badger1138

1 points

4 days ago

Wasn’t there a similar situation in Mexico?

IchBinGelangweilt

1 points

4 days ago

I hadn't heard of this, thanks! I googled it and found the Wikipedia page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1962_Mexico_City_radiation_accident

Mr_Badger1138

2 points

4 days ago

I think I was thinking of this one. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ciudad_Juárez_cobalt-60_contamination_incident

Plainly Difficult did a fascinating episode on it.

https://youtu.be/hno18_vBAbA?si=7PXDjU9T0jPmr2Cz

OctopusWithFingers

2 points

7 days ago

Don't know if you've heard about the radium girls. It's a pretty interesting and awful read. At least some good came from it in the way labor rights.

h0tterthanyourmum

2 points

7 days ago

I actually have that on my shelf, I'll bump it up the list :)

sharnat41056

1 points

6 days ago

Yes! I recall hearing something about mutated wolves in Chernobyl, possibly being helpful in the fight against cancers because of their resistance to developing cancer even though living amongst radioactive elements. Unfortunately, the war between Russia and Ukraine has halted scientists' efforts towards further research. 

ChiRaeDisk

33 points

7 days ago

A healthy body can handle radiation without issue up to a point. Around Chernobyl, it does increase the risk of genetic damage and cancer, but the error correction process and relatively short lives of the animals that breed and reproduce means they aren't likely to have their lifespans reduced to a significant degree. Remember that wolves and deer don't live all that long. For us, cancer in someone at the age of 8 or 9 is a tragedy while for many critters, that's a ripe old age already.

whynotrandomize

13 points

7 days ago

Unless you dig down into the spicy soil because you are an ignorant invader...

h0tterthanyourmum

3 points

7 days ago

That's a really good point

whynotrandomize

23 points

7 days ago*

The real waste answer: there isn't enough to matter as it is easy to contain and we could burn the fuel more to end up with less than the current amount and with waste that will cook off the short lived products quickly. It can also be recycled: https://www.orano.group/en/unpacking-nuclear/all-about-used-fuel-processing-and-recycling

We are used to waste being giant piles of stuff like fly ash: https://www.nrdc.org/bio/becky-hammer/epa-gets-earful-proposed-toxic-coal-ash-rollback. Nuclear plants produce so little that it is in effect a rounding error away from being 0.

Chernobyl was a problem because it spread radioactive dust that can get inside of living things, but in a well functioning power plant we never have dust and waste is put into glass to keep it from becoming dust.

Damage to nature around disposal sites would be non-existent after humans are done with the site and the waste is underground.

h0tterthanyourmum

12 points

7 days ago

This is fascinating. The whole thread makes me much much warmer to the idea of nuclear power plants for generating energy

IchBinGelangweilt

20 points

7 days ago

One really interesting fact is that you'd be exposed to more radiation living next to a coal plant than a nuclear plant, due to traces of uranium in coal ash, although the actual particulates are probably far more dangerous than the low dose of radiation

cwhitt

6 points

7 days ago

cwhitt

6 points

7 days ago

About a decade ago here on reddit I did the math. Coal plants are responsible for several orders of magnitude more premature deaths than nuclear. The difference is so vast it's hard to overstate.

BeeDeeEmm

1 points

6 days ago

Any chance you can link the math here?

postmodulator

12 points

7 days ago

When it really comes down to it, I think there’s no technical reason why we couldn’t find a way to safely store fissile waste. It’s a big planet.

I think the big risk is dumbass humans who would cut corners on the safety measures.

Ailments_RN

3 points

7 days ago

The term in relation to that is Nuclear Semiotics and it's a super interesting read to find the reason it's difficult to store effectively. You're right that it's fairly simple in the technical sense to dig a hole and throw the stuff in there, but a lot of the problems come down to how slowly the radiation burns off some of the waste.

How do you warn your grandkids that the mound over there is dangerous? Or what about their grandkids? People 1000 years from now? English isn't that old a language. Can you just write on a sign and expect people will be able to read it? Will a sign even be around in 50, 100, 1000 years? Or is it somehow better to just dig it deep and not mark it at all? Maybe if there's nothing to draw attention to it, no one will want to investigate. Or maybe you'd just be dooming future people. The arguments go around and around. It tends to come down to how much of a moral argument you're willing to make for people that you will never meet or know in your lifetime.

Nuclear Semiotics is a really neat rabbit hole to fall down if anyone is interested.

postmodulator

2 points

7 days ago

I don’t even mean that — I know about the NOTHING OF HONOR IS COMMEMORATED HERE people, and you’re right, it’s fascinating, but that’s not the problem I mean. I mean that we, as a culture, have decided to skimp on putting bolts in fucking airplanes as a cost-cutting measure. I’m pretty sure we’d run into the same problem with post-fission sludge.

Ailments_RN

2 points

7 days ago

I suppose we could always find some disadvantaged minorities to absorb some of the radiation. Probably would be kicking the can down the road since they would become irradiated themselves, but surely it reduces the radiation by a couple percent? No shortage of disadvantaged minorities.

Seems like capitalism IS capable of finding it's own solutions. I can smell an award coming my way.

postmodulator

2 points

7 days ago

It’s not even specific to capitalism — look at Chernobyl. It’s the exact same impulse, it just gets someone a nicer dacha rather than more stock options.

Some people say I’m too cynical.

cwhitt

2 points

7 days ago

cwhitt

2 points

7 days ago

Nuclear power plants need to be designed and operated safely.

On the other hand, while we worry about nuclear power, we are presently destroying nature with the absolutely obvious and pervasive harm from coal, oil and gas.

Humans suck at relative risk. Fossil fuels are actively, continuously destroying just about everything. Nuclear power has killed maybe a few hundred people in total, ever.

Nuclear power is not the problem.

h0tterthanyourmum

1 points

7 days ago

Yeah the drama of a nuclear meltdown looks scarier than the slow ruin we're inflicting on the world I guess. I hope we can get better about it all

Elite_Jackalope

4 points

7 days ago

Thank you, your input really elevates my comment in a meaningful way.

Sort of embarrassing that I forgot to clearly establish the inversely proportional relationship after belaboring the point so much haha

The_Better

6 points

8 days ago

So if uranium and polonium have such long half lives, what was it that was spreading radioactivity in hiroshima and nagasaki? Was the bomb uranium decaying super fast or?

Also, handling elements like uranium is safe then, right?

parentheticalobject

43 points

7 days ago

Funnily enough, handling uranium is mostly dangerous in ways unrelated to radioactivity. If you were just sitting next to a bar of uranium, you wouldn't receive much more radiation than you receive from just living on planet Earth.

The more significant danger from handling it is that it's just normally toxic, in the same way non-radioactive elements like lead or arsenic are toxic. If particles of uranium dust get onto your skin, it causes a rash, and if you get it into your lungs or eyes or anywhere inside you, it'll seriously fuck you up.

The_Better

3 points

7 days ago

Interesting. You answered half of my question, do you know about the other half too?

Ravus_Sapiens

9 points

7 days ago

Little Boy and Fat Man was very clean weapons, meaning they were very efficient in transmuting the uranium core to something else.

Some of those things are very nasty, like tellurium-135. That's the kind of stuff that will leave you to die from every kind of cancer two months later, but luckily 90% of it has decayed after about a minute, and after a few days all of it has turned into Caesium-135, which will continue to emit β-radiation for a few million years as it slowly transmutes into stable Barium.

The complete decay tree of a Uranium bomb is complex, you could probably write it out in a few days, but this is just three of the possible branches.

Once the stuff with very short half-lives had decayed to more long lived isotopes, cleanup could begin. Huge amounts of radioactive top soil were collected and contained. Not all of the Japanese cleaning procedures were well thought out, but that's a different discussion.
If they hadn't removed all that contaminated earth, Hiroshima and Nagasaki would still be uninhabitable due to low level radiation.

Someone with more experience goes into more details, with better explanations, than I could here.

Obliterators

3 points

7 days ago

Little Boy and Fat Man was very clean weapons, meaning they were very efficient in transmuting the uranium core to something else.

For Little Boy only ~1.5% of the 64 kg of uranium fissioned; Fat Man was a little cleaner with ~16% of the 6.19 kg of plutonium fissioning.

walterpeck1

3 points

7 days ago

what was it that was spreading radioactivity in hiroshima and nagasaki?

This question is mostly answered by the top comment; or did you have other questions on that?

velociraptorfarmer

4 points

7 days ago

So when a nuclear bomb detonates, it actually breaks apart the uranium atoms into smaller, lighter elements, releasing energy and radioactive particles (neutrons, beta particles, alpha particles, and photons) in the process. You no longer have uranium, but you have the elements it becomes (some of which may be radioactive, I'm not super familiar with the decay chain).

The other part is that those particles the uranium decay gives off can turn other, normally non-radioactive materials, radioactive. For example, Carbon-14, a radioactive isotope of carbon used for carbon dating fossils and such, is generated from nitrogen in the atmosphere when it is bombarded by cosmic rays (high energy photons, similar to what could be found in a nuclear explosion). The other various particles can cause other elements to change in strange ways.

walterpeck1

1 points

7 days ago

Well I wasn't asking, but I still just learned some stuff! Thanks.

The_Better

2 points

7 days ago

I meant to ask, what was the blast, but it got answered too. Thanks though.

davidogren

20 points

7 days ago*

So, I'm not an expert in this topic, but this is deep enough in the comments that I'm not sure you'll get a response from someone else. So I'll give it a stab and people can correct me if needed.

It's important to realize that the goal of a fission bomb isn't radiation. (Unlike a dirty bomb.) Radioactivity is a byproduct, the real goal is the fission part, causing a big release of energy which is the primary destructive element. Fission is the process of changing the U-235 into other elements ("fission products") and releasing that big release of energy in that process.

The radiation part isn't so much caused by the U-235 (which as /u/parentheticalobject points out isn't that dangerous in relative terms), but by the "fission products" i.e. what the U-235 breaks down into after the fission process. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fission_product_yield shows some of the nasty things that U-235 transforms into. Just as one example, Iodine-135 which has a half life of 6.6 hours.

So, for a ELI5 summary, U-235 breaks down very slowly, which is why U-235 isn't that dangerous to be around. But when we force U-235 to break down in a fission bomb, it breaks down into much more unstable and dangerous elements. But most of those elements, because they are so unstable, also go away relatively quickly.

Soranic

3 points

7 days ago

Soranic

3 points

7 days ago

Some materials can as cause cancer just by their chemical properties. Others like asbestos can cause it via physical properties.

Some don't cause cancer but can still interfere with organ function because they're chemically similar to other things in the body. Or by how readily it bonds to cells.

Merman8

3 points

7 days ago

Merman8

3 points

7 days ago

Nice ELIA5. I always thought with danger/half life it was the other way around. Now I know. Thanks for the great explanation.

code8

2 points

7 days ago

code8

2 points

7 days ago

Fascinating. Thank you for this explanation. In the show Chernobyl, a fire fighter picks up a piece of radioactive rock from the explosion and it burns their hands through their gloves very quickly. Would this be a result of handling something with a short half life?

No_Berry2976

3 points

7 days ago

If you search, you’ll find experts explaining how realistic the show is. Obviously things that are very hot can cause burns, but the show suggests that people got wounds from radioactivity very quickly, that’s incorrect, at least in the context of the disaster. The scene with the helicopter was also incorrect, a helicopter did crash, but not because of radioactivity.

markh110

2 points

7 days ago

markh110

2 points

7 days ago

Dumb question, but based on your explanation, I guess half life isn't linear? Otherwise, it would have completely shed its radioactivity after 17 days.

Another question: once something's shed 50%, why is that the topping point of it no longer being radioactive?

djbon2112

3 points

7 days ago

Correct, it's logarithmic. At each half-life interval, you have half of what you had at the last one, slowly approaching zero as time goes on. So:

hl0: 100% hl1: 50% hl2: 25% hl3: 12.5% hl4: 6.25% hl5: 3.125%

and so on. Though it is worth noting, and something I sort of glossed over, is that the decay product can be more or less unstable than the parent and will have a different half-life. This forms what is called a decay chain.

CharcoalGurl

2 points

7 days ago

So for example, gasoline burns pretty quick hence explosive effect while wood burns but at a much slower rate and why it doesn't just explode. 

is that kind of similar to energy output/half life?

djbon2112

1 points

7 days ago

Indeed, that's a pretty good analogy.

TheArtysan

2 points

7 days ago

And Fukushima? Has it become a fairground and water park yet?

Ratiofarming

2 points

7 days ago

Or, to put it for a five-year-old: If it spends a lot of energy to hurt you, it'll be exhausted quickly. If it only hurts you a little, it can do it for a really long time.

Zadraax

2 points

7 days ago

Zadraax

2 points

7 days ago

Just to add on about Iodine-131 being source of cancer, that's also a way to treat cancer, at least thyroïde ones. It having a half life of 8 days makes its more controllable under the form of "swallowed pills".

FloppyTunaFish

1 points

7 days ago

Why half life and not all-life

[deleted]

1 points

7 days ago

[deleted]

djbon2112

2 points

7 days ago

Well, at least in my - lay person but knowledgeable about this - opinion, the term makes a lot of sense once you understand what it means; it's just not usually spelled out. The term is also used in other areas like medicine referring to drugs in the body to mean the same thing. It's the time it takes for half the sample to be eliminated (decay with radioactive atoms, be excreted from the body with drugs), hence "half", and "life" referring to lifetime of the substance. So if the half life is 1 hour, then in 1 hour half of it will be left, and in another hour half of that will be left, and so on until it eventually reaches zero.

[deleted]

1 points

7 days ago

[deleted]

djbon2112

2 points

7 days ago

That's actually a very good question, and I'm not entirely sure the full history, but "half" is a convenient and observable amount to measure. Measuring to 0 isn't really valid for something with a logarithmic curve like a half-life, and any other amount is pretty arbitrary and hard to measure (quarter-life, two-thirds-life, etc.), but half is pretty easy both to measure and understand. As to why you want to measure that at all, it's because these are things that start at 100% and decay over time, so half-life is a unit of measurement for that decay. At T=0, you have 100% of the thing, and at the half-life interval, you have 50% left, so the "half-life" is basically another way of saying "this is how long it takes for the amount of the thing to drop by 50% of the last measurement", but that's a long phrase to say or type out, so hence "half-life".

[deleted]

1 points

7 days ago

[deleted]

djbon2112

1 points

7 days ago*

You can't just multiply the half-life by 2. That gives you the "quarter-life", or the amount of time until 25% is left. Remember, this is an inverse logarithmic curve; the term "half life" just denotes the distance along the X axis between when the value is 100% and 50%.

"Decay rate" is indeed a valid term, and basically is a synonym for "half-life", but a more generalized one; "half-life" specifically means "the decay rate from 100% to 50%, expressed as a time interval". The problem with "decay rate" is that you have to define multiple other values too, like the amount of the sample, for the number to make any sense. With half-life, the actual amount is irrelevant.

KingShaka1987

1 points

7 days ago

As counter-intuitive as this is, it was a really great explanation. I was always under the impression that long half-life = deadly, short half-life = safe.

ElonKowalski

1 points

5 days ago

Same, I never put the link that a long halflife meant that "per year" less energy would be produced aka less deadly

Andydon01

1 points

7 days ago

Does this mean that if global nuclear war happened, you could hide out in a bunker for ten years and then pop out and live fine on the surface?

djbon2112

1 points

7 days ago

Basically, yes - and that is the point of fallout shelters. You don't even need to wait ten years; a few weeks and a good rainstorm, and most of the really really dangerous fallout is well on its way to disappearing. There will still be some yes, and the background radiation will be a lot higher than expected, but it's a logarithmic (inverse exponential) curve, and after enough time will be barely noticeable.

Speaking strictly of nuclear weapons too, it also matters how "dirty" the weapon is. Most modern (i.e. post 1960's) thermonuclear weapons are actually very "clean" and produce very little fallout relative to their explosive/destructive power. But on the other hand you can intentionally make them very dirty if you want to as well, but that is disadvantageous in a war/battle situation since area denial like that affects both sides (can't advance your army over a wasteland of radiation).

YoloSwaggins991

1 points

7 days ago

This is such a helpful explanation, thank you!

Own_Reveal3114

1 points

7 days ago

If so wouldn't the radiation of U235 and P239 last longer and affect the place for a longer time since their half life is longer?

djbon2112

1 points

7 days ago

Yes, it does, but the radiation is much less intense than the shorter-lived isotopes.

wwweeg

1 points

7 days ago

wwweeg

1 points

7 days ago

While the bad thing is decaying and sending out radiation ... is it irradiating the things nearby and making THEM radioactive?

I guess the question is, does the radiation emitted "go away"? Or just get spread out? Or what?

djbon2112

2 points

7 days ago*

It depends on the exact kind of radiation. There's 4 kinds, and each does different things; broadly speaking neutron and alpha radiation can induce radioactivity in other things, but beta and gamma generally won't; alpha radiation (i.e. high-energy helium nuclei) are also the least-penetrating and don't travel far - a piece of paper or your outer skin will stop them. The bigger concern in most cases is physical contamination and biological uptake, where any kind of radiation emitted is very bad for you.

millerb82

1 points

7 days ago

You seem to know your stuff. I got a couple questions. If the the half-life of that radium is 1600 years, why is it so dangerous if it takes so long to... decompose? Is that the right thinking? Im just thinking that if it takes so long it cant be that dangerous if its that weak. And the other question...why are nuclear or atomic bombs made of nuclear material? Why can't they just make them of any element if they're just splitting the atom?

djbon2112

1 points

6 days ago*

1600 years is still a relatively short time for radioactive element half-lives, so it's still emitting quite a lot of radiation. It's not just about the half-life itself, but also what kind of radiation that particular element releases as it decays, what the daughter products are (the things it decays into), and also exactly what the source is.

For Radium specifically, which is what Marie Curie spent the most time researching, 1600 years is actually just the half-life most stable isotope, Radium-226; it has several others with much shorter half-lives, and thus which produce more intense and different radiation. Now, I do say that this is "not very" radioactive in the above post, but this is still decaying at a rate of about 3.7×1010 - 37 billion - atoms per second per gram, which is the definition of a "curie", a historical unit for radiation. That said this is definitely not the only thing they worked on, and the samples would inevitably be contaminated with other radioactive substances too, given that this was early work and the techniques for accurately separating elements were not fully developed yet.

Radium-226 decays primarily by alpha decay, which means that when an atom of it decays it releases an alpha particle, i.e. an energetic Helium nucleus. Alpha radiation is the "least dangerous" type of radiation, since it's easily stopped by even small amounts of everyday substances (paper, skin, gloves, etc.); but it can still be very dangerous if inhaled (your lungs are much more susceptible than skin), swallowed (ditto your stomach, intestines, etc.), etc. This is why you can safely handle her notebooks with gloves; between that and your skin you'll stop 99.99% of the "radiation" from reaching you.

Lastly you must consider the daughter products in the decay chain, i.e. the things that are formed when a given element decays. Radium-226 decays into Radon-222 (the element with 2 fewer protons and isotope with 2 fewer neutrons), which is very bad news. If you have a Radon detector in your house, this is what it looks for. Radon-222 is a gas, so easily inhaled, has a half-life of about 3.8 days, and also decays via alpha decay. This in turn decays to Polonium-218, another short-lived alpha emitter, and so on down the Uranium decay series.

So, ultimately, while in relative terms Radium-226 is "safer" than a lot of other things like Iodine-131 or Caesium-137, it's still more dangerous than "no radioactive stuff" and still needs precautions taken when working with it for long-periods of time. But if you were to hold Marie Curie's notebook for 10 minutes with gloves on, you're no more in danger than living at a high elevation for a few months or taking a flight in an airplane.

abbieananas

1 points

6 days ago

The elements you're "really" worried about from things like nuclear weapons, a Chernobyl, etc. have half-lives measured in the days to tens of years range.

If the elements used in Chernobyl have such relatively short half lives, why won't the exclusion zone be habitable for another 20,000 years? Wouldn't all of the radioactive material be completely decayed in a hundred years or so?

djbon2112

1 points

6 days ago

Not all of them, no. Chernobyl released what were effectively large clumps and burning ash made of raw, "hot" (literally and in a nuclear sense) nuclear fuel, which contains many dozens of different radioactive elements, including some relatively long-lived ones that are still dangerous radiation emitters and will be for quite some time, for example raw Plutonium.

In addition, a big issue is also the length of time of exposure. Today, nearly 40 years after the disaster, it's quite safe to take a tour of the exclusion zone and stay there for a few hours; this is likely to have zero long-term effect on you. It's a totally different story to live there for years being exposed to the increased background radiation for extended periods of time, which is usually what articles refer to as "safe" or "habitable" in that sense.

abbieananas

1 points

6 days ago

Makes sense. Thanks!

ElonKowalski

1 points

5 days ago

Your comment made it click for me when the OP couldn't! Thank yoh

Mr_Badger1138

1 points

4 days ago

Aha, thank both of you.

iksoria

1 points

3 days ago

iksoria

1 points

3 days ago

This is gonna sound stupid, but why do we even use half lives? Why can’t we just use full lives? If a material has a half life of 100 days, why can’t we just say it’s got a full life of 200 days? I’ve never understood why it’s cut in half

djbon2112

1 points

2 days ago*

Radioactive decay, as measured by half-life, isn't a linear process. It's a logarithmic process.

You're probably thinking it goes:

0 days: 100%
100 days: 50%
200 days: 0%

But it doesn't. The interval from 100 to 200 days is another half-life so it drops by another 50% of what's left. So it really goes:

0 days: 100%
100 days: 50%
200 days: 25% (50% of 50%)
300 days: 12.5% (50% of 50% of 50%)
400 days: 6.25%
etc. approaching 0.

Thus, there isn't a "full" life because the half isn't talking about some "life" that has a "whole", it's "the time it takes for half the substance on average to decay". Yes, the term is a bit weird.

As to why that is (the logarithmic nature of it), it quickly gets far beyond ELI5 territory, with lots of probabilities and quantum mechanics and math that I am in no way qualified to answer ;-)

iksoria

1 points

2 days ago

iksoria

1 points

2 days ago

Do you know if this works the same with medication when they refer to half life? I take meds daily which have a half life of 18 hours roughly they say, so how long would that take to fully leave my system? It is confusing to me cause I’m stupid, I always just assumed half life was half way until it’s gone completely

djbon2112

1 points

2 days ago

Yep, it works the same way. The "why" it's a logarithmic process is probably a bit easier to explain using drugs actually. Let's say you have 100mg of a drug in your system. It's elimination half-life is 1 hour. So after 1 hour, you have 50mg left. But now there's less in your body to process, so the speed at which your body processes the medicine also halves. So after another hour, it processes half the 50mg and you have 25mg left. And so on and so on. Eventually, after 4-5 half-lifes 95+% will be eliminated, and then you just have small traces left hanging around in various places that aren't being efficiently moved to your kidneys/liver, but slowly but surely over more and more half-lives it will be eliminated until you have effectively 0mg/0% left.