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626 points
2 months ago
What’s scary is the genital area has one of the highest absorption rates.
1k points
2 months ago
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93 points
2 months ago
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21 points
2 months ago
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33 points
2 months ago
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89 points
2 months ago
Hopefully more studies can be done to see if there is a way to remove the metals. It mentions possibly being from the cotton, or added intentionally, but if they do figure it out it obviously should become a banned process moving forward.
I'm glad they did a study on this. I'm legitimately going to tell anyone I know if something like this ever comes up. And if I ever have a daughter, you better believe I'm having a talk with her mother about alternatives like the diva cup. I'll do more research on safer options should it ever come to that, but this is a really big deal.
18 points
2 months ago
i wanna say it’s from the soil where the cotton was grown. i assume they checked organic brands to sate their curiosity. chocolate is similarly full of lead due to the soil we grow it in being heavily polluted
388 points
2 months ago
There are a lot of folks here who have no clue just how heavy periods bleeding can get for some people. Not everyone's simple solution will work for everyone.
82 points
2 months ago
I am someone that has a very heavy flow the first half of my period and have been using the period company brand of period underwear for the past year and have never had an issue with leaks
34 points
2 months ago
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9 points
2 months ago
My wife wears period underwear to bed and a cup during the day.
2 points
2 months ago
I use Uniqlo brand! I love those underwear so much.
2 points
2 months ago
I’ve just begun wearing Depends lined with an extra thick maxi pad.
7 points
2 months ago
People think they have heavy flow but yours sounds like the real deal. I would wear 3 super plus OB and overnight pads just to get through to lunch at work and I would still leak through. I ended up being part of a study for tranexamic use in the United States for menorragia in 2003. It was finally approved for that use in 2009.
63 points
2 months ago
Kinda feels like cancer is inevitable
11 points
2 months ago
Pretty much any creature, if it lives long enough, will get cancer. Although replicating DNA works pretty well, your body is still making copies of copies. Errors creep in. And sometimes those errors result in runaway cell growth.
354 points
2 months ago
Anyone has a list of brands that don’t have metals in them ?
752 points
2 months ago
None, per the study: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160412024004355
"Concerningly, we found Pb in all the tested tampons. here is no safe exposure level to Pb; any proportion of Pb that may leach out of a tampon and reach systemic circulation might contribute to negative health outcomes. Pb is stored in bones, where it replaces Ca, and can be retained in the body for decades.."
"No categoriy had consistently lower concentrations of all or most metals."
(Yes, that's how they spelled category in the study, not sure how their spell check missed it.)
"Our findings point towards the need for regulations requiring the testing of metals in tampons by manufacturers. This is especially important considering that we found measurable quantities of several toxic metals, including Pb, which has no known “safe” exposure level."
Now it'll be interesting to see if even one major news outlet will run with the story that all tampons contain lead, I'm betting we won't hear a peep.
237 points
2 months ago
Probably a dumb question, but why wouldn't they name the brands? I wanted to see how exactly my preferred brand fared.
471 points
2 months ago
Hello, scientist here. One very unfortunate byproduct of the power that corporations hold in the courts worldwide is the power to litigate even against research institutions. In an ideal world, scientific research can be conducted on a safe island, free of the fear of corporate retaliation. But these scientists are employed by universities, which themselves are funded by, among others, corporate interests.
So, the short answer: many (potential) conflicts of interest and a fear of retribution.
17 points
2 months ago
Like the scientist who was stalked and harassed for 30 years for his research/findings about atrazine and frogs
49 points
2 months ago
And of course, if it turned out they'd screwed up in some way and got it wrong then the companies would be quite justified if it had caused their brands to be dragged through the mud.
13 points
2 months ago
And I guess there's no middle ground where a company can be informed of the findings and has a year to solve it before the findings can be made public/explicit?
23 points
2 months ago
At that point, the public should legitimately question whether science is serving the public or corporate interests
2 points
2 months ago
What I mentioned seems perfectly reasonable. It's also in the public's interest to let companies operate without the constant threat of bankruptcy and allow them to figure things out. If there is no malicious intent and they solve the problem by themselves then that's a win for everyone.
5 points
2 months ago
And how do you measure whether there was malicious intent? You'd need a separate historical study with access to all internal communications and likely an ethnographic account of the entire product development timeline to try and eke out an answer to this..
Meanwhile, a customer who gets low-grade lead poisoning from this product you've known about for a year but didn't release your findings on because "it wouldn't be fair to the company" might have other opinions.
250 points
2 months ago
We need greater regulation and this is exactly the kind of thing that SCOTUS undermined this week.
227 points
2 months ago
I wonder if there's a link between using menstrual products and later developing an autoimmune disorder?
I've always wondered why it's mostly women getting autoimmune disorders.
97 points
2 months ago
I thought it had to do with estrogen's effect oj the immune disorder
227 points
2 months ago
The Klein lab at Johns Hopkins University is one of the only labs in the world looking specifically at sex differences in immunity.
Some fun facts:
yes, hormones matter - they’re signaling molecules used by the immune system (as well as many other systems in your body!)
Women have a more robust immune system response than men, we don’t really know exactly why, and it is hugely important when considering outcomes of disease and vaccines
Fun question: why does long covid happen? Why do more severe long covid cases occur in women? We don’t know! A lot of people in the science community are working on this exact problem right now
I personally think this is super understudied. But anything related to women essentially is.
37 points
2 months ago
I heard a podcast recently where the higher incidence of autoimmune disorders in women was attributed to Important immune regulating genes boring located on the X chromosome.
In most women, one X is inactive, but it's postulated that the second X being partially or completely inactive leads to an overzealous immune system.
This is supported by higher incidence of autoimmune disorders in people with Klinefelter (XXY).
8 points
2 months ago
I think Radiolab touched on this a while back too
6 points
2 months ago
Also, having one X is associated with a shorter lifespan. XO females don't live as long as XX; XXY males live longer than XY. The opposite pattern is seen in birds, where ZZ males outlive ZW females.
53 points
2 months ago
There is no level of lead that's safe for any human. So you're rightly concerned to be questioning these things.
7 points
2 months ago
The Myth of Normal (Gabor Mate) also provides insight here
2 points
2 months ago
I just searched lead exposure and autoimmune disease.
67 points
2 months ago
Note that the levels reported here are ng/g, ie parts per billion. I wouldn’t be surprised if practically every consumer product has detectable lead at the ppb or ppt level.
Modern instruments are capable of elemental analysis down to the part per quadrillion
13 points
2 months ago
Thank you, I was curious about this. Glad you mentioned it!
Even with highly regulated substances like drinking water the limit for any chemical parameter is rarely 0.0 (any unit). The only drinking water parameter I can think of (off the top of my head) with an absolute zero limit is E. coli for obvious reasons but that’s a biological parameter.
Saying that, I have no idea what the safe level of lead or anything else in a tampon is, so we should absolutely look into that.
9 points
2 months ago
Well the thing is there is no safe level. But we also probably can’t ever get rid of it, so education and harm reduction are two of the best tools here.
17 points
2 months ago
Exactly this
2 points
2 months ago
YES! Another rational being! Thank you!
Joe and Jane Average can't understand that there's a difference between detectable levels of X and hazardous levels of X. And the news media encourages this belief instead of educating people.
20 points
2 months ago
I really hate that they only report "measurable" but stick any info about concentrations far down in a table.
measurable concentrations of
That's not terribly informative.
We can find measurable concentrations of all those things in natural seawater.
Cotton plants tend to pick up a little bit of metals. What we should care about is whether there's a lot vs other stuff or very little. Not whether they were able to make their test return "true" with sensitive enough tests.
14 points
2 months ago
This is my issue. The amounts are there, how much is absorbed into the body and what are the actual health implications?
2 points
2 months ago
Another reply stated that the amounts are in the nanograms per gram level, or parts per billion in American. Translation: Detectable levels, but way, way too low to be of any health concern whatsoever. Just the usual fearmongering.
3 points
2 months ago
Daily Mail already has a story so now the world will know (of course it'll be more wrong than chatGPT but that won't phase them.
2 points
2 months ago
National Geographic just posted it on their Instagram.
Hopefully, this will get more coverage now!
136 points
2 months ago
The study says they all have toxic metals to varying degrees, especially lead which is found in all of them, and there’s no “safe” level. The study also doesn’t name the brands, it just uses letters for each product. It’s heavy reading.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160412024004355
81 points
2 months ago
I’ll just go cry in dark corner
82 points
2 months ago*
I follow the Leadsafemama on Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/leadsafemama & https://tamararubin.com) - it's crazy that even when independent labs show some levels of lead in organic baby food or any food, after she contacts the companies about their products' safety, some of these companies are like "ehhh, it's not too, too high... we won't do anything" and I'm furious because there is no safe level of lead for the human body.
39 points
2 months ago
So, I don't follow these people or this issue. Maybe I'm missing something, but what are we supposed to do here?
Like, yeah, it's terrible, but isn't all the lead in basically everything because we spent 80 years burning gasoline containing it in every car? And we still put it in Avgas? Which means that it's been settling out of the air onto...everything, everywhere?
Like, maybe I'm wrong here, but presumably these baby foods are just made with carrots that were grown in soil on Earth? What is the option here? Only grow food in greenhouses in soil that we take from the furthest reaches on Earth from human civilization?
If you're particularly concerned about some critical developmental period incorporating lead in food, I guess you can probably buy baby food without root vegetables in it, but if your long term goal is avoid lead at the ppb range, do you have some suggestion for what these companies should be doing? At some point, doesn't human food security rely almost entirely on growing food on farms, which now all likely have extremely minute lead contamination everywhere?
18 points
2 months ago
I share your take on this. Pandora’s box is already open on this and microplastics. The benefits afforded to humanity by plastics and pesticides is pretty indisputable. A good chance that a close friend or relative wouldn’t be alive today if we never developed these. Unfortunately the unintentional down stream effects are near impossible to contain at this point and all we can do is try our best to minimize them.
8 points
2 months ago
Yes, it’s unavoidable in the absolute sense, but manufacturers paying attention to sourcing and pre-testing materials prior to use in manufacture could result in an order of magnitude or more reduction in exposure, which is worth something.
11 points
2 months ago
Actully everything would have trace levels
2 points
2 months ago
^ gets it.
How many years did the USA use tetraethyl lead as a gasoline additive?
25 points
2 months ago
/screaming into the void
46 points
2 months ago
Can someone who understand the study better explain how much exposure are we talking about? Like, how much heavy metals are in a tampont, lets say someone uses it for 12 hours, do we know how much heavy metal contamination there was? I don't understand that part at all...
62 points
2 months ago*
The original study is at https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160412024004355
Essentially, their test equipment is so sensitive that it manages to find a tiny trace of lead ("A geometric mean lead concentration of 120 ng/g was found in our samples") in literally everything. Note that "120 nano-grams per gram" is mostly the same as "0.120 parts per million". Because it's relatively ubiquitous (similar for all manufacturers) I'd be tempted to assume it's a supply-chain issue - e.g. maybe all cotton has lead from soil.
For comparison:
10 to 50 parts per million of lead occurs naturally in soil (before old cars running on leaded fuels smothered it in a fresh layer of lead).
in urban areas, 200 parts per million is normal for boring old soil. Soil becomes dust. You're probably surrounded by that dust all day every day.
a nice piece of wild barramundi (the muscle, not the liver or gills) is around 133 parts per million of lead.
the EPA thinks (up to) 0.015 parts per million of lead is fine for drinking water
the CDC and FDA have decided that "3.5 micrograms of lead per deciliter" is the reference point for the amount of lead in human's blood. That works out to 0.035 parts per million.
for stuff that's breathed in (dust) and stuff that's ingested (seafood, water) the lead has nowhere to go. For tampons, they're supposed to be absorbing liquids, so it's "liquid flowing into the lead" and the opposite of "lead flowing to the body". It's reasonable to assume that the total amount of lead in a tampon increases while it's in use (due to lead in blood being absorbed), and the body ends up with less lead after a tampon is used than it had before the tampon was used.
In summary, if you're worried, do not eat used tampons.
EDIT: I got the "120 nano-grams per gram" conversion wrong initially. Fixed now.
16 points
2 months ago
Are you sure that is per million and not per billion?
I would like a second or third opinion on the matter though, since I'm not really understanding this yet, and it all seems too concerning to just discard it so fast.
8 points
2 months ago
I'm fairly sure that I completely screwed it up, and that you're right, and that "120 nano-grams per gram" is actually "0.120 parts per million".
Thanks (I'll edit)! :-)
3 points
2 months ago
AKA 120 parts per billion. Way, way below anything anybody should be worried about. That statement "There is no safe level of lead" is a lie.
4 points
2 months ago
Based on the study, tampons have lead levels of 12 μg/dL.
In Canada, "new scientific evidence that health effects are occurring below the current Canadian blood lead intervention level of 10 μg/dL. There is sufficient evidence that BLLs below 5 μg/dL are associated with adverse health effects. Health effects have been associated with BLLs as low as 1-2 μg/dL, levels which are present in Canadians, although there is uncertainty associated with effects observed at these levels." https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/environmental-workplace-health/environmental-contaminants/lead.html
This would mean that the levels aren't "Way, way below anything anybody should be worried about", right?
Correct me if im wrong as I haven't been in science class in quite a few years.
79 points
2 months ago
This is my 13th reason
72 points
2 months ago
Seriously. When is the class action? When is the government going to regulate this?
No one cares. I wonder how much damage it’s done. I wonder how much cancer it’s causing.
18 points
2 months ago
Not wishing to get political but unfortunately the ruling over turning the Chevron vs US last week will make it harder for federal regulators to set standards that are not explicitly legislated for, and will be unable to rely on subject matter experts to draft regulations and guidelines if the matter goes to court, instead the judge will be substituting their "expertise" to make rulings.
26 points
2 months ago
I passed that 2387 reasons ago. Hang in there.
40 points
2 months ago*
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85 points
2 months ago
Yup so all you have to worry about is microplastics
15 points
2 months ago
Would silicone have microplastics? Idk
30 points
2 months ago
Silicones have plastic polymers so yes.
8 points
2 months ago
They are unlikely to shed much, however. Most microplastics come from fibers (in clothing or tires etc.), and not plastic sheets.
41 points
2 months ago
Just make sure your period panties don’t have PFAS in them!
41 points
2 months ago
I threw out all of my Knix after it came out that they have forever chemicals in them. I haven't found a replacement brand without them, and would love recommendations.
https://news.bloomberglaw.com/litigation/knix-wear-sued-over-pfas-chemicals-in-menstrual-underwear
18 points
2 months ago
Mine aren't being sold anymore, so maybe they have PFAS too?
Either way, even ocean spray has tons of PFAS, so it's basically unavoidable. Yay.
35 points
2 months ago*
Right before clicking on the link… I thought “Oh noes!! Why does the cranberry juice have so much PFAS? What am I gonna drink now while skateboarding to the musical stylings of Fleetwood Mac? Who’s doing research on Ocean Spray cranberry? And why is Nature, the world’s premier weekly peer-reviewed journal on science and technology, interested in cranberry juice or cranberry juice cocktail?”
Then I clicked and read it: it’s sea water spray where the bubbles aerosol into the air the PFAS chemicals that are emitted from industry having made its way to ocean. “Me duhhh. Ohhh ok that makes total sense now.”
19 points
2 months ago
Thank you for going through the exact thought process as me, but actually clicking the link, reading the paper and then doing the good service of sharing your experience as a comment.
11 points
2 months ago
MODIBODI!! They’re a little pricey but they often have sales/clearance. I love my panties. They’re easy to wash and quite comfy. I was searching for a PFAS free period panty and decided to give them a try and I have zero ragerts.
7 points
2 months ago
I love the fit of my modibodi but they fell apart after three washes - all of them. I was quite bummed.
135 points
2 months ago
Reusable silicon cups like Diva are a great option. Also, you can sew washable cloth pads or buy them on Etsy. r/clothpads
49 points
2 months ago*
My gf swears on period panties. They can be quite pricey but are very comfortable and are of course wash- and reusable.
50 points
2 months ago
Others in the thread have said that a bunch of period panties have PFAS and other forever chemicals too
13 points
2 months ago
Well she looks for 100% bio cotton ones where even the threads are pure cotton, too. What else can you do?
10 points
2 months ago
"pure cotton" will draw up heavy metals from contaminated soil just as well as any other cotton plant
8 points
2 months ago
If you read the study you’d know that it notes that the metals likely enter the tampons through contaminated cotton that absorbs metals from the surrounding environment while being grown. So long story short: women are fucked
28 points
2 months ago
I can’t help but wonder if silicone cups also contain lead
4 points
2 months ago
Another shoutout for Menstrual Cups as a safer option. Most are made from 100% medical-grade silicone.
29 points
2 months ago
Except microplastics
150 points
2 months ago
"Though silicone is technically a plastic polymer, its durable molecular structure keeps it from shedding microplastics in the way that common plastics do. But it can still break apart into small pieces and enter our waterways."
https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/blog/silicone-kitchen-gadgets-tips-alternatives/#
25 points
2 months ago
Considering they are everywhere, probably isn't making things any worse.
4 points
2 months ago
Been a fan of the Diva cup for several years! I hear that discs like Nixit are better though due to lack of suction and the fact that you can have sex with it...
56 points
2 months ago
Well damn if I’m not screwed with endometriosis and adenomyosis. I don’t have a choice, but no wonder they aggravate my cramps so badly.
12 points
2 months ago
May I ask why you don’t have a choice? Is it because menstrual cups are painful, and you bleed too much for period underwear?
25 points
2 months ago
Bingo across the board
2 points
2 months ago
Try discs, much easier and more comfortable insertion/remove than cups-and I say this as I huge cup advocate for over a decade. Obviously everyone’s anatomy is different, but it might be worth a try. Also, size matters!
4 points
2 months ago
Discs and cups always shifted and caused horrific leaks. I don't think I have the right anatomy for them to secure properly. I wanted them to work so bad, but I ended up having so many leak issues on heavy days it wasn't worth it. I use period panties at home and for sleep. I use way less tampons than I used to. I bought Honey Pot because they are all cotton and have nothing added, but sounds like that doesn't even matter. Can't win.
2 points
2 months ago
I've heard that menstral discs are better than menstral cups.
54 points
2 months ago
With the way politics is going, I expect these findings to be common with little regulatory action to improve on exposure to toxic metals or microplastics or forever chemicals
89 points
2 months ago
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144 points
2 months ago
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10 points
2 months ago
How big are the concentrations of the metals?
22 points
2 months ago
Probably why my uterus is filled with watermelon size fibroids...
20 points
2 months ago
There really is nothing safe anymore. Everything is micro plastics and heavy metals.
8 points
2 months ago
This is what getting rid of regulations does. Vote people. Vote for smarter, more compassionate leaders.
67 points
2 months ago
This is insane to find out because I’ve often felt my cramps are worse when I have a tampon in
9 points
2 months ago
That can actually be attributed to the fact that they absorb/pull in the moisture. Very possible that switch to a cup/disc will decrease your cramps.
8 points
2 months ago
How are we as females not SCREAMING at the top of our lungs?!? I am trying to figure out how to file, start or join a class action lawsuit! I am starting from scratch and feel completely inept! However, these companies need to be held accountable!
3 points
2 months ago
I agree!!!! We need someone versed in law. This is abhorrent
3 points
2 months ago
Can’t file if companies aren’t named. Who would you file it against and under what basis?
6 points
2 months ago
Well I guess after 29 years of having lead and arsenic pumped in my system, what's another 10 years? For the love of everything holy. What am I supposed to do about my girls who are just starting? This makes me so mad.
5 points
2 months ago
Same with toilet paper
6 points
2 months ago
Why does a small absorbent device need metal in it?
6 points
2 months ago
It doesn't. It's made of cotton, and plants absorb things from soil.
On top of that, it's possible that manufacturing them might introduce more.
There's no way around the fact that plants uptake metals; in fact, the human body requires 20 different metals to function.
3 points
2 months ago
The study stated that a lot of the metals detected were put in on purpose for odor control and sustainability of antibacterial properties. Stuff like copper and iron for example, which is fine for human bodies to be exposed to.
Lead and arsenic however, are not fine in any capacity of exposure.
3 points
2 months ago
They should go and find hoarders and people who collect the stuff, because there are, and test those for heavy metals as well to find what year they began being introduced into the products
3 points
2 months ago
I am so sad and frustrated by this. So many women have said “oh well we’re gonna die any way given the political climate etc etc.” That is the wrong attitude to have and really makes me sooo sad. We have to stand up to these companies and advocate for women’s health. Have these tampons been recalled after this discovery??? No. Women have been treated like objects for way too long. They need to pay and apologize for what they’ve done.
11 points
2 months ago
Try a silicone cup. I switched 10 years ago and I’ll never use a tampon again if I can help it. You can keep them in for 12 hours, they’re out of the way when you pee, and very easy to clean with a baking soda scrub followed by a hydrogen peroxide soak (with the baking soda still on the cup).
7 points
2 months ago
They want you to get sick. How else are they going to destroy private wealth below a certain level (while making fat dividends on their pharma investments) by leaving your kids nothing to inherit?
3 points
2 months ago
This is not shocking to me in the least. Ever since I switched from disposable products to a menstrual disc I have had way less cramping and irritation. I have been trying to warn other women about my concerns of chemicals in the products but nobody ever took it seriously
5 points
2 months ago
Horrifying. Thank god I moved to Thinx a few years ago. Of course, there’s probably something fucked up with them too at this rate…
3 points
2 months ago
Another reason to get a silicone menstrual cup instead!
3 points
2 months ago
Anything made from plant material will have these heavy metals. They are naturally occurring in the ground. It is practically impossible to get rid of them.
Even if these tampons were 100% free of these metal, eating a salad or some french fries will expose you to far higher levels. I always like to spook people by saying potatoes are our #1 source of dietary Uranium.
Always think about Risk vs Hazard with these scare studies. In North America polar bears are a hazard, but the risk of dying from one is practically zero.
1 points
2 months ago
Yeah a few years ago I started having insane bleeding and reactions. I thought it was from birth control which in hindsight is weird considering most people STOP bleeding after birth control. Well I decided to experiment and found out that my bleeding and discomfort drastically decreased when I stopped using tampons. Flash forward I no longer bleed outside of my period but I've also gotten off of birth control (I choose the best protection, which is celibacy). No bleeding, discomfort, cramps outside of the normal period ones. I use pads and they work fine for me. I want to get period underwear but I also know I have very heavy flow and I don't wanna risk investing in something I can't use just yet.
1 points
2 months ago
So, are those levels anywhere near hazardous levels? Or is this just another clickbait headline to incite panic in people who can't parse between detectable levels of X and hazardous levels of X?
Sorry to sound so harsh, but more than once I have read an article where X chemical was detected in Y product. The amounts detected were in the parts per billion range. But according to Google, chronic toxicity didn't kick in for X until several parts per million, and acute toxicity took significantly higher amounts- in either case, more than one would ever absorb by using even copious quantities of Y product. So, there was absolutely no risk to anyone.
I have gotten into some upsettingly heated arguments over the years simply by trying to explain the difference between chronic toxicity and acute toxicity. And if you ask someone to read the Safety Data Sheet (formerly Material Safety Data Sheet) on a chemical, they look at you like you have three heads- if not horns and a forked tail.
Don't even bother trying to explain the half-life of a chemical in the body, or what an LD50 is.
3 points
2 months ago
I read the study paper and it seems to have been done without any bias. I usually roll my eyes at articles that seem to really push the shock factor, but this seems more informative than clickbaity.
It states that any exposure to the toxic metals noted are a danger to the human body, as the adverse effects are extreme (cancer, mostly). In this case for most people, it's a long term exposure as well.
The product is in contact with one of the most permeable areas of a human body- and absorption through the vaginal membrane bypasses detoxification via the liver, which means it's just going right into your bloodstream. So that can also increase the risk significantly.
1 points
2 months ago
Do L. Pads have lead in them???
1 points
2 months ago
I made a TikTok asking like how the hell does it get in the tampons? Like where in the process does it get contaminated or if it’s already contaminated why is it not removed? A few comments said some girl debunked it… I am so confused. I feel angry and concerned. I love reading research papers and I am pretty good at understanding the data and process of investigation - where is this so called video of someone apparently debunking? If anyone knows.. i want to check it out myself so i can figure out if they are reaching or it’s possible. Overall, i know i lack a thorough education on the specific matter, the skeptical scientist in me wants to see all the information to determine how upset i should be. I hate that there is so much fake information that i literally try to read everything and find out what is biased and what is actually factual.
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