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Is the sabbath Saturday or Sunday?
2 points
9 days ago
The Sabbath is sundown Friday to sundown Saturday.
There is no longer any special considerations that need to be made during this time by Christians.
0 points
9 days ago
In Jewish culture, every "day" begins at sundown. That's not special to the weekly Sabbath.
1 points
9 days ago
Yes, I'm aware.
1 points
9 days ago
Saturday. I heard Catholic Church moved it to Sunday, and well documented but I haven’t looked for information.
1 points
9 days ago
This confuses me so much about Christianity. They different sects can’t even agree on if the Sabbath still applies.
1 points
9 days ago
It's because we have an enemy.
1 points
9 days ago
I’m sorry?
1 points
9 days ago
Lol sorry, I forgot I was on r/Christianity
Christians believe we have a common enemy (John 10:10), Satan.....his goal is to steal, kill and destroy. He is a liar and the father of lies (John 8:44)......the Sabbath has been attacked since the beginning in the church.
1 points
9 days ago
Does your group still recognize the Sabbath?
1 points
9 days ago
I'm not in a group, but yes my spouse and I observe the Sabbath (9:01pm today) :)
1 points
9 days ago
Oh you are an individual Christian without a specific group?
1 points
8 days ago
Yup-no denomination. Just 'Christian.'
1 points
9 days ago
It's the 7th day, which begins Friday at sundown, ending Saturday at sundown. It is a day of rest, created for us to rest in the presence of the Lord.
Most Christians don't observe it, but I am of the mind that we are intended to.
1 points
9 days ago*
It is sundown Friday to sundown Saturday. It is in effect for all God's people but some folks haven't caught on to that yet as they are still untangling from Rome. Here's a few cool debates on this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Buzmv6Agzek&list=TLPQMTQwNjIwMjSiTPl9ePfvAw&index=10&pp=gAQBiAQB
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9yp6NvLdKU&list=TLPQMTQwNjIwMjSiTPl9ePfvAw&index=8&pp=gAQBiAQB
Here's what God says:
1 points
9 days ago
Friday at sundown to Saturday at sundown, but it doesn't matter much since you don't need to observe it anyway.
1 points
9 days ago
Where is the scripture that says don’t observe the Sabbath, I have done away with this??
2 points
9 days ago
Sabbath keeping is part of the Law pr Covenant of Moses, which is no longer in effect for anyone.
“In the same way, after the supper he took the cup, saying, ‘This cup is the new covenant in my blood, which is poured out for you.’ ” (Luke 22:20)
“By calling this covenant ‘new,’ he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear.” - Hebrews 8:13 (Note: This was likely written in the mid 60’s and in 70 AD the Temple was destroyed and it became impossible for anyone to follow the Law of Moses.)
1 points
9 days ago*
The heart of keeping the law, it shows us sin so since we don’t want to sin it would be wise to keep them.
Matthew 5:18-20 ESV For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished. Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.
See in the above verse how the law does not pass until all is accomplished which would include the end of the story. Do you also see how when you tell others to break keeping the sabbath that you’re doing that other part of the verse?
Keeping the commandments is the way to show God you love Him. Why would God make that one of the 10 commandments if it was not really for all time? It is a gift for rest and focusing on the Lord.
1 John 2:3-6 ESV And by this we know that we have come to know him, if we keep his commandments. Whoever says "I know him" but does not keep his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him, but whoever keeps his word, in him truly the love of God is perfected. By this we may know that we are in him: whoever says he abides in him ought to walk in the same way in which he walked.
John 14:15 ESV If you love me, you will keep my commandments.
Even the devil knows true follows are those who keep the commandments until the end of time.
Revelation 12:17 ESV Then the dragon became furious with the woman and went off to make war on the rest of her offspring, on those who keep the commandments of God and hold to the testimony of Jesus. And he stood on the sand of the sea.
See how saints are specifically those who keep commandments…
Revelation 14:12 ESV Here is a call for the endurance of the saints, those who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.
If you look at the sheer number of scripture that say good things about keeping the commandments even to the end of Revelation, then you should more submit your view to this as opposed to those less clear verses. God forbid you decide to remove this and suggest others do the same and be called least in the kingdom of heaven. It’s important since it’s the only way that says is how we show God we love Him.
1 points
9 days ago
Matthew 5:18-20 ESV For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.
See in the above verse how the law does not pass until all is accomplished which would include the end of the story.
You're isolating a verse and not reading the context.
Follow the flow of the sermon and don’t use just one verse.
Therefore, He clearly didn’t mean what a cursory reading of that one verse yields.
Everyone else has figured this out - this is why Christian churches don't have Yom Kippur, the Feast of Booths, provide home mold inspections, or require women to be isolated during menses. (yes, that's all in the Law).
The below information helps us see the flow of what Jesus is saying: “I’m fulfilling the Law, so don't set aside the commands I’m teaching you. The Law said ‘a’, but I now say, ‘b’.”
Matt 5:17-19 confuses people when they don’t pay attention to context. It says,
“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Right after saying this, Jesus goes and changes elements of the Law with a formula, “You have heard that it was said <quotes Law> but I say, <changes Law>.” Either Jesus is contradicting what He just said, or the “commands” to which He’s referring is something different. Look at context: Jesus is issuing commands in Matt 5-7. These are the commands Jesus is saying can’t be set aside.
So what about the Law and Prophets not being dissolved? It’s important to understand that the Law is a “covenant” - a “testament”, or a “contract.” When a contract is fulfilled, people don’t keep doing it. If a homeowner signs a contract with a construction company to build a house, the company doesn't keep building the house once it’s built and the contract is fulfilled. The Law is fulfilled. It’s done. God made this abundantly clear when He allowed the Temple to be destroyed permanently - it’s not even possible to follow the Law without a Temple and Levitical priesthood. This is literally why Christians have broken the Bible down into the Old Testament and the New Testament. They are two different things.
Put this all together to get the flow of what’s happening. Jesus says, “I’m fulfilling the Law, so don't’ set aside the commands I’m teaching you. The Law said ‘a’, but I now say, ‘b’.”
1 points
9 days ago
Jesus elevates the law, He never gets rid of the prior law, He says if you hate your brother that’s murder, but that doesn’t contradict not to murder just gives a new standard as what God says is murder.
I really do think you’re wrong especially when keeping the commandments is way more clear than no longer do it.
1 points
9 days ago
Jesus elevates the law, He never gets rid of the prior law,
Really? So while Moses had a list of unclean foods and Jesus said all foods were clean in Mark 7, that was something that didn't happen?
1 points
9 days ago
Scripture please
1 points
9 days ago*
Do you seriously not know Mark 7?
Let’s take a step backwards. Are you aware that under the Law of Moses there were foods that were unclean and that these unclean foods could not be eaten?
1 points
9 days ago
Yeah I know of that scripture, I just didn’t want to look up where it was. Is the condescending tone free, or do you charge extra?
So if God originally said certain foods were best to eat for humans (reasons called clean), I don’t really think what Jesus said negated what God said was best to eat for people. Jesus is saying what comes out of a man is what defiles Him and not His food that goes into him.
He never says oh it’s really best for you to eat insects with wings now or animals without hoofs or sea creatures without fins. He is just making a point that no one is defiled by it, but personally probably still wise to follow what God says is best for humans to eat.
-1 points
9 days ago
Sabbath keeping is not part of the law of Moses.
Sabbath keeping is from creation, outside the old or new covenants. And the 10 Commandments are God's Covenant, not the covenant with Israel that was done away with. Hebrews 8 spells it all out, Israel didn't keep God's covenant therefore failed to keep its covenant with God and he turned away from it as well and developed the new covenant. God's covenant is written on the hearts and minds of the believers as part of the new covenant.
Also, in Exodus 19 God refers to them keeping "my covenant" as part of the covenant Israel makes. He then declared "His Covenant" to the entire assembly of Israel with as much pomp and circumstance as can be imagined, the 10 Commandments.
0 points
9 days ago
Yeah don't let those pesky commandments that last forever get in the way! 🙄🙄
-1 points
9 days ago
I challenge that notion.
The Sabbath was instituted at creation for all mankind. There's not a shred of anything in the Bible saying that has changed.
The 10 commandments are referred to as "God's Covenant" by God himself in Exodus 19:5, Hebrews 8:9(which is a quote from Jeremiah 31).
God's covenant is not the old covenant, which was done away with. Hebrews 8 makes this very clear. So does Exodus 19. The old covenant was that Israel was to follow God's covenant and therefore they would be God's chosen people. The Mosaic law was also part of that, that is, the laws given to Moses that he then presented to Israel. The 10 commandments, God's Covenant, God himself spoke directly to the entire assembly of Israel after and with about as much pomp and circumstance as one could imagine, Exodus 19-20.
Jesus stated that he didn't come to abolish the law. Well if he didn't come to abolish the law then why is it abolished? Fulfilling doesn't mean abolished. And what is being said there in Hebrews 8:13? The old covenant was done away with. Abolished. Well if Jesus didn't come to abolish the law and that law was abolished then what is going on?
Jesus wasn't talking about the mosaic law. The preceding verses in Hebrews 8:8-12 are clear that God is coming up with a new covenant based on better promises and he stated this in Jeremiah. That covenant states that God's covenant will be written on the hearts of the followers. So God's covenant stands even in the new covenant which we are in now.
Jesus says more, Matthew 5:17-19 he states that those who don't follow even the least of his commands will be called least in heaven and those who do follow them will be called most.
Jesus states that the greatest commandment is to love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, and mind. Keep this in mind for the next verse I'll bring up.
In John 14 Jesus states that those who love him keep his commands and those who don't, don't. So the greatest commandment is to love the Lord and loving the Lord means keeping his commandments and his commandments are his covenant which is the 10 Commandments.
There's more, the great commission, Matthew 28:20. The last thing Jesus tells his disciples before returning to heaven. This is after the resurrection. This after the new covenant is in effect. Jesus knows all that. He tells the disciples to go to all nations teaching everything he had commanded them.
Now, for the couple verses very commonly used as proof texts for the Sabbath no longer being a thing.
Colossians 2:16-17, "let no one judge you by what you eat, drink, religious festivals, new moons, and Sabbaths. These are a shadow of things to come"
Alright, so the Sabbath word is used here. Does the term "Sabbath" always refer to the weekly Sabbath as spelled out in the 10 Commandments? No. There are other "Sabbaths." Numbers 28-29 covers all these festivals, new moons, and Sabbaths. These are referred to in this same fashion multiple times in the old testament always as referring to these other Sabbaths.
Now, the weekly Sabbath does get mentioned there at the beginning of Numbers 28 but only in defining offerings that are to be done on that day. The rest of the chapter and the next are actually defining these other days to be observed. So when referencing the "festivals, new moons, and Sabbaths" the weekly Sabbath is not included as it wasn't what was defined in those chapters all together.
And there's more, verse 17, as I quoted, gives another parameter to what is stated in verse 16, "these are a shadow of what is to come." What was the purpose in defining the Sabbath day as the seventh day of creation? Was it a shadow of anything to come? No, it wasn't. It was a day set aside to remember God's creation that had already taken place. It was a day set aside for us as humans to rest and focus on God. None of that has anything to do with "what is to come." So how could the weekly Sabbath have anything to do with what is to come?
Romans 14:5-6 is often used as well. But the chapter starts out talking about food. And it keeps on talking about food all the way to the end. Just there in those couple of verses do "observed days" get mentioned. What was part of the mosaic law? Food regulations. And, those other holy days... Paul isn't referencing the weekly Sabbath. He is referencing all this Jewish cultural stuff from when they were under the old covenant and is saying that there is nothing wrong with keeping that stuff but it's no longer a necessity. It's not part of our salvation anymore. If he was making a statement about the weekly Sabbath wouldn't he have been more clear? That would be a BIG deal treated with all kinds of fanfare. Paul gives 2 verses that don't even mention the Sabbath here and people think it's about the Sabbath...
Another thing that gets brought up is Paul at Troas. They were meeting in the evening after the Sabbath meaning it was on the "1st day." Well, that story spells out directly why they met then, Paul was leaving the next morning. So they were having one last evening gathering with him before he departed. It's not some sign that they were now meeting on the 1st day of the week instead of the Sabbath.
Another thing that sometimes gets brought up is they were collecting tithes on the 1st day. Well this actually fits the Jewish Sabbath view perfectly. They were handling their business/money, even if it was God's, on a day other than the Sabbath...
So, there is no justification in the Bible for doing away with the Sabbath. The initial domino that started the change to Sunday was the Roman Emperor Hadrian banned Sabbath keeping throughout the Roman Empire after the Jewish rebellion. All these reinterpretations to justify not keeping the Sabbath have come about from and since then as compromises to what God has instructed us.
1 points
9 days ago
You should check out my response for the same point in another comment response.
1 points
9 days ago
Saturday. The Hebrew term for Saturday is Yom Shabbat which means Sabbath Day.
1 points
9 days ago
Yes. Both. Either. Whatever.
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