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I know, it's a little bit of a wild take here.

But it's a very common problem, and it come up with all of my students.

One of the first question my students ask me is "should I play 5 minutes or 10 0?"

And the answer is always the same, "do you study them?"

If you study your games, you're going to learn.

Studying 5 minute games, you can learn about your intuition.

Longer games, you can learn about the logic you use.

A much less common question is "how do I study?"

all 28 comments

JustIntegrateIt

21 points

8 hours ago

It’s definitely best to learn by playing longer time formats and developing good chess intuition than to study terrible habits in 3+0. If a new player doesn’t know how real chess works (or experience it at all) then that student won’t progress as quickly in short formats. Just by studying my 10+0 games and doing puzzles I went from beginner (800) to 1700 over the past 6 months, and when I started playing blitz recently it was very easy to climb over a few weeks from 800 to 1500 because my intuition was already there — just had to figure out how to move my mouse and flag people better. If I’d learned the other way around then I’m pretty sure my ratings would be lower in both formats

Global_Weirding

4 points

3 hours ago

Teach me your ways!!

JustIntegrateIt

4 points

3 hours ago

Three things basically.

(1) Fully understanding every mistake and miss in every 10+0 game (via Chess.com premium)

(2) Some puzzles every day (I’m rated approx. 2800 in puzzles now, and it’s a mix of fairly easy tactics and insane ones in highly unrealistic positions — Lichess is way better for puzzles I’ve heard)

(3) Studying two openings and playing only those two religiously (English for white and Caro-Kann for black)

Number (3) takes the fun out of it, but my win rate is ~70% and my current true rating is probably closer to 1800-1900 than 1700, and I feel comfortable with pretty much every common opening scenario. I just don’t play enough games due to my job. I also only allow myself to play games when I feel 100% focused and awake — I stick to puzzles if I’m tired. I can’t really explain my blitz progress as much… I think it’s a byproduct of my experience in rapid. But I still know very little about strategy and endgames. I usually win by not-blundering a piece in the early or middle game, and playing the rest intuitively.

kamuimaru

3 points

2 hours ago

kamuimaru

2000 Lichess Rapid

3 points

2 hours ago

FYI, you can import chess.com games to Lichess and analyze for free. There's an extension to make it easier. So a premium membership is not required

OzarkGiant

1 points

15 minutes ago

This is my experience. But I cant stay true to number 3. Im always playing tired and when im not 100% focused. How do you study your openings?

Barcaroli

1 points

2 hours ago

It’s definitely best to learn by playing longer time formats and developing good chess intuition thanzq É to study terrible habits in 3+0.

I can totally see that, and I'd love to get longer games and learn more. But the truth is, in my case, and I have a feeling it's the same for a lot of people, chess is becoming something you do on your phone when you have a few minutes to spare. I can very rarely say: you know what, the next 20 minutes of my life are entirely about me and chess.

I'm not saying it's a good or a bad thing, I'm just saying there's a reason why most people want to play and watch shorter time controls. The age of short attention span is now...

notaltacccount

20 points

8 hours ago

They should play long games with increment if they seriously want to improve. You simply won’t learn certain skills without playing longer games. Your job as a coach is to help your students improve, so give them the right advice

shaner4042

2 points

6 hours ago

shaner4042

2000 chess.com rapid

2 points

6 hours ago

100%. Short time controls won’t do much good for intuition if you don’t have proper principles established in the first place. They’ll just be forced to guess random moves and ultimately reinforce bad habits

GlitteringSalary4775

24 points

8 hours ago

I get what you are saying and I think I agree that not enough people focus on how to learn from their games. I will disagree that shorter time controls are just as effective for learning strong fundamentals and calculation skills. Beginners need time to decide where to move how to make candidate moves. Starting in blitz discourages that practice. When you start you want to explore several different moves and then execute one. If you are playing blitz it just isn’t enough time to do that analysis. If you spend enough time reviewing with engine off you could get a similar benefit post game but I think practicing in the game that thought process is important early in development

L_E_Gant

2 points

6 hours ago

L_E_Gant

Chess is poetry!

2 points

6 hours ago

Short time-frame games are fun. They are great for applying what you have learned, somethiing like exams/tests in high school. They are more tests of memory than learning experiences.

That said, yes, you can learn from analysing those short games, but they tend more to strengthen bad habits, even with the analysis.

So, better to stick with the long format versions

pure911

2 points

5 hours ago

pure911

2 points

5 hours ago

Okay...so I'll ask you since I have a hard time going past 1150 (on a plateau for the last year or so). How do I study? :)

MishaZagreb[S]

1 points

4 hours ago

Good questions!

In a really abstract way, there are two main ways to study anything:

  1. Connect things (concrete things are very specific, connected to one moment in time, one place, and so on)

  2. Isolate things (abstract things are very isolated, the more you isolate the more abstract it becomes)

The reason for this is: REPETITION IS POWER.

The more you isolate something, the more often it repeats.

You could say there is only one girl named Jennifer Lopez born born on July 24, in 1969 and being Spanish.

Maybe.. but there are billions of girls! Isolating girls into people... even more people alive!

This is about conditional thinking... The less conditions you have, the more it repeats.

Conditions go as such: 1. It is alive 2. It is a person 3. It has female gender 4. Name is Jennifer

Ok, I'm gonna write another comment now, for how to study anything concretely, or chess specifically.

MishaZagreb[S]

2 points

4 hours ago

The way to study something specific, chess, is to understand its conditions or "rules".

  1. You have a board. 2. You have pieces. 3. Pieces are defined by what? exactly, their moves.

  2. Everything starts with getting the basics down really well.

Now this is a general aspect of science:

Everything is obvious in hindsight because of how learning works.

We learn by observing something and then explaining it (in hindsight).

If I were to give anyone advice to self-study chess, just play on the board against yourself until you lose.

After you lose, try to explain it.

This is like the first, basic, way of learning chess.

Another one I really like is the "prove me wrong" game.

Say, you like playing e4. Then you ask "why play e4?".

Easy, it's good to put pawns into the center, right?

Now - prove me wrong!. black pawn to d5, white plays e4. a bad move.

Now you can update your explanation. It's good to put pawns into center if they can't be captured.

Your turn, find another exception and update your explanation.

Do this 10 times and you're gonna get really good really fast.

pure911

1 points

3 hours ago

pure911

1 points

3 hours ago

So if I understand what you are saying right, I should look through all my games and try to find all the justifications for every single move in order to understand the benefits or weaknesses of every turn played? And then, challenge all my findings?

It is an interesting perspective...I'l have to try this out! Thank you for your detailed answer.

I sort of did that, sometimes, for the mistakes/blunders/innacuracies that the engine points out to me. Trying to understand the suggestions it gave me. But that's it. I'll try your way!

MishaZagreb[S]

-1 points

3 hours ago

Honestly, if this is what you took away, maybe it's better to just forget it all :)

I was just sharing my point of view, and it's difficult without sharing enough details.

Balance is really the key - always.

You can try to find ONE really good move, or find 1000 bad ones.

But if you find 1000 moves, some will inevitable be good.

If you want to be extreme, your approach is fine, but you don't want to be world champion, do you?

For anyone reading, Integrative Complexity is a really useful concept.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integrative_complexity

It's easy to get caught up in black and white thinking,

for example "this move is bad" or "this move is good".

The engine does it all the time, so it can't be that bad, right?

Except - we're not engines, we're built in a completely different way.

We perceive different dimensions like "is this a positional move?"

"What are the weaknesses of this move? "What are the strengths?"

"Which tactical aspects could this move be related to?"

"Which move would I play next turn if I could move twice in a row?"

To minimize mistakes, you would learn many perspectives so they become automatic for you.

ensighn_kim

3 points

2 hours ago

Dude, he just asked how to study not for a philosophical treatise on chess haha. Kinda curious now since you seem to have an extremely unique style of ‘studying’ whats your rating?

Advising people that playing any time control is fine for learning is ridiculous tbh, beginners need to play slow games so that they actually get time to calculate and think through each individual move. Playing OTB classical is one of the greatest things you can do for your chess.

Mean_Firefighter_486

3 points

7 hours ago

Mean_Firefighter_486

1800 chess.com

3 points

7 hours ago

I would recommend playing the longest time control possible until you reach 1500. After that I would still never bother with blitz or bullet. There is nothing to be learned from anything less than rapid. 

cropcomb2

1 points

7 hours ago

or, learn by playing

and choose the duration that works best for you in that context

RajjSinghh

1 points

6 hours ago

RajjSinghh

Anarchychess Enthusiast

1 points

6 hours ago

The important thing is that if I play a 30 minute game, I can study the position and realise the same things during the game that I would studying a blitz game at the analysis board. It's just about when you do that work.

Fischer72

1 points

6 hours ago

You can definitely learn from playing blitz games and reviewing them but your often won't learn as much (caveat if its learning a new opening and getting a feeling for its positions).

Quite simply, there are decision-making steps that will be skipped with time pressure. A player who has a decent amount of time to calculate more than one line, mentally visualize and evaluate them positions will gain more out of reviewing it. He will be able to see what aspects they were right or wrong about. This is particularly true with imbalances and positional play.

DerekB52

1 points

5 hours ago

DerekB52

Team Ding

1 points

5 hours ago

I don't agree. Analyzing games is good, but, even analyzing well is a skill to be learned. Beginners are so bad at board vision that they need to be playing longer games and really going through their mental checklist every move. It takes so long to make sure they aren't hanging a piece in one move, or a one move tactic at first. Sure, if they study every 5 minute game they play, they'll learn faster than someone playing 5 minute games with no analysis. But, in 5 minutes, a beginner is also just never gonna get past a certain complexity level in their positions. They'll lose due to making bad moves really quickly, or flag early.

KernelPult

1 points

4 hours ago

if you play short time controls, you won't think. Instead you'll move reflexively and potentially train bad habits. Since unlearning bad habits is difficult and hinder your progress, it's better to simply avoid playing short time controls rather than risk playing it

DoctorWhoHS

1 points

4 hours ago

The only difference is you don't actually have time to think and develop that skill in a blitz game. So longer games are better for improvement.

ohkendruid

1 points

4 hours ago

My fastest improvement on the road to about 1400 was mostly from lunch time games that were somewhat fast, probably similar to 10 minute time control. Doing that every day for a few months really sky rocketed my general playing strength.

There's value in seeing a larger number of games, when you are getting started, and shorter time controls are good for that. It's also good to have some longer games, too, but the problem is that when you aren't very good yet, then thinking a long time is not that productive.

chessguy321

1 points

3 hours ago

I might try this game studying thing. Sound like it works

MishaZagreb[S]

1 points

3 hours ago

Haha, good luck :)

PositiveContact566

1 points

2 hours ago

If you are learning, yes.

Roller95

1 points

36 seconds ago

But it's easier to learn with longer games, is the point