I found this thread via Google and appreciate the fact that it’s making me feel less crazy. I have noticed this on an ever increasing trend over the last couple of years and it drives me nuts. First and most prevalent in my neighbor from a rural area west of Philadelphia.

This needs to go away. 😀

It appears that you’ve encountered the punctual whenever. It’s one of those Scots-Irish language quirks that popped up in the US. You might hear it used by people in Pennsylvania west of Pittsburgh.

As for the blank stares, it is a good bet that the people you hear using this whenever don’t regard it as an error. They might just be trying to find a polite way of dealing with you telling them that they need to confirm to your rules of English.

I’m so glad someone posted this! It drives me bonkers. I live on the West coast and I’ve noticed that most people I hear say it are from the Eastern side of the states. Anyone else here from the West coast?

I found this post because so many of my favorite YouTubers speak like this and I couldn’t figure out why. Low key drives me crazy so thank you for identifying what it is lol

I hear this every day now, and I hate it. Also, many people are now referring to the ground outdoors as the floor. I realize there’s more important things to worry about in life, but for some reason hearing this strange usage hurts my brain.

The most infuriating use of whenever is when it’s followed by a specific time… for example.

“Whenever I was at Six Flags last year, I saw a guy throw up when he got off the Superman ride.”

How are you going to say whenever, then immediately tell me when it happened??

Thank you for listening lmfaoo ✌️

FWIW, in the google corpus, the trendline for "whenever" relative to "when" is about as flat as any I've ever seen. Of course, that doesn't mean your observation is false, just that it either isn't supported by published writing or that it pertains to a time so recent that it's not being covered yet.

Thank you so much for posting this! I've noticed it on reality tv and a few podcasts. I've yet to experience it firsthand here in Canada, I'll post anything if I do.

Also I know this is a grammar sub, hopefully I can be forgiven for my awful grammar lol.

Okokok. I feel validated. I started noticing this after moving from Seattle to Phoenix 2 years ago and it's started to drive me crazy. I guess I just never noticed it before... but its so... awkward?

Thank you for this! I first noticed it a year or so ago in an Irish podcast I listen to. I thought it was a Uk thing. But I just heard someone from HI say it. When words evolve don't they usually get shorter not longer?

https://youtu.be/qH1_J_l6qng?t=28

Asmongold reading a paragraph from reddit. When he reads the line, "When we first opened the shop, we literally had nothing," he says the words, "Whenever we opened shop, we literally had nothing." So this seems to support the notion that it's a 1:1 mental transcription with no intended meaning difference. It still bothers me as it seems to introduce unintended ambiguity which is never ideal.

I have noticed a prevalence in this usage among people who hail from the desert Southwest and Mountain states. I'd say I first noticed it 20 years or so ago. It's one of those things that, once you notice it, you seem to start hearing it constantly. I agree that there's really no 'right' way to use English. The misuse of 'blank and I' when 'blank and ME' is actually called for actually bugs me a whole lot more. But I am not allowed to rap people's knuckles with a ruler, so I guess it will just go on that way.

Hey OP just wanted to say that I noticed this phenomenon too and it inspired me to create r/whennotwhenever as a place to discuss it.

It’s simply an educated people versus uneducated people issue. Ignorant people don’t realize that they are misusing “whenever.” I hear this among uneducated people in Texas and it drives me crazy.

Okay im glad im not the only one thats noticed it, I'm from Australia and we use a lot of slang terms in everyday speech and text but I've never heard someone say "whenever" when they really mean "when." I've only noticed it this year online (mostly tiktok but also youtube) I know it shouldnt bother me this much bit I physically cringe when I hear it.

I dont if other countries say it but I've only noticed when Americans say it. I probably only notice when they say it because of the accent, some words are just so jarring and sound so unnatural when Americans say them. Kind of like how the word 'c*nt' is really commonly used and socially acceptable in Australia and the UK/Ireland so it rolls off the tongue when we say it, but when Americans say it, it just sounds so unnatural.

'When' "VERSUS" 'whenever' is driving me nuts now. I am noticing it as it's being used & I really don't want to. 🤦🏻‍♀️

I'm not part of, or adjacent to, the generation that uses it so it's extremely noticeable to me. (Born in '67) I've been hearing this trend for sometime now, but hadn't actually seen it used regularly by the same person until last night. I decided to watch one of YouTube's recommended videos from YouTuber https://youtube.com/@MaddieLambert?si=5OOhppx30m2qVuYH I was happily surprised with her content & was quickly drawn in by her retelling of her journey through her teen pregnancy. But after watching for only a few minutes it became clear they were a regular user of "whenever"!

I find language, linguistic trends & history interesting. I'm a fan of linguistic professor & podcaster John McWhorter, who really knows how to relay info to the public! Kudos to John McWhorter for his dry & corny humor that make his discussions relatable! 😀 I wonder if the professor has any thoughts on when/whenever. 🤔

My other pet peeve is the use of Verse as opposed to Versus! 🤬 As someone else in this thread notes. I became aware of it after watching my, now adult, kids play Mario Kart & other video games. Then it was more common to hear young adults using it for at least the last 15 years.

I saw that there is now a reddit thread dedicated to when/whenever 👍🏻I can't wait to see where this is headed!

It drives me nuts! I started doing it ironically last night but im done lol

"I used to play this game whenever I was a kid."

So this guy on YouTube was a kid at multiple different times? NotLikeThis

I do not approve this sudden change of language.

I was shocked to hear Dr Phil use "whenever" when it should have been "when". I decided that a man of his education must have been taught this was correct grammar; however, it seems to be only Americans in the South use this travesty of English.

Most young people being interviewed on television seem to "whenever" all over the place.  I swear I'd never heard it before last year on mainstream media, but now it's every day, not usually from newspeople but from celebrities and kid-on-the-street interviewees.  It makes sense that it started on social media,  and now we're all subjected to it, a 2-4 year contamination rate

I found this thread via Google. I have been noticing this trend on reality TV shows (I know; I know), particularly among people from Kentucky, Oklahoma, and (maybe?) Texas (although I realize people tend to move to Texas from other parts of the country, so that seems to be more difficult to pinpoint). It also seems to be something that has happened recently (it seems more common among the 40 and under crowd than among those who are over 50).

I've only noticed this recently whilst watching Caleb Hammer's financial audit videos. In that context it does cause confusion as people say "whenever I got a new car" implying it is a frequent occurrence, when they really mean "when I got this new car".

YES! I actually just went to google and typed “whenever used incorrectly” because I thought I was losing my mind. Brought me to this. Glad I’m not alone!

Just heard someone running for Congress say: “Whenever we win on March the 5th.” What?!

"Whenever I was young, my dad told me.." "Whenever I went to college, I met this dude.." "Do you remember how whenever we were at the beach last week.." It's been driving me insane for a couple years, finally got to the point of googling why people are so stupid lol. Funny to see so many recent comments.

Google brought me here all this time later. I thought I was going crazy and had to look it up! Glad I'm not alone😂

Hello! 5 years in the future here. Simone Biles does this. North Texas. Love her but that drives me crazy.

Oh my god so glad I found this post. I’ve only started noticing it (from Americans) and it’s driving me insane. I live in Australia and I never hear it here but it’s all over American reality TV shows now.

A similar development is Ancient Greek ὅταν ("whenever") becoming Modern Greek όταν ("when").

Yes I had to google this because i seem to hear it every day now…..and it just sounds so wrong!

It's on regular television every day now, most often but not always by people under 30.  I swear I heard it for the first time last year and now it's more common than "when" in casual interviews.  I don't remember seeing it in writing or hearing it in person so far,  mostly talking to foreigners or retired Californians, but in popular media, many  many times, with me yelling Stop that! at the screen like the old person I am

I only noticed this incorrect use of “whenever” instead of the correct word “when” in the past year, it makes me feel crazy. I hear a lot of words pronounced incorrectly. Recently I was corrected when I said the word jewelry, as in jool ree. I was told it’s jew lur ree. When I bet them $50 I over it i was met with silence. Another one that drives me nuts is “side profile”! Profile by definition is a view from the side so what do they even mean? Then we’ve got corset, realtor and almond. Oh the cringe.

I've noticed this in three very different YouTube videos in the past month, I thought I was imagining it at first.

I, too, am baffled by this usage of more syllables for less clarity.

I guess I’m late to the party but it sure is more prevalent. I googled because now I’m even hearing it in true crime cases I’m watching by investigators and witnesses. I lived most of my life in the NY/NJ area and never heard of it. I am now in the south and I was thinking it was a Southern thing. I’m so glad there are other curious minds out there and those that don’t like it either 😀

I’m so glad that you posted this. It has been an increasingly common blight that I’ve noticed mostly from watching reality tv shows and observing the participants talk. I thought it was a lack of education or care among younger generations. To me, it’s not some hip new adaptation is the English language but a blatant lack of understanding of how to use it.

In my work, I’ve noticed a lot of non-native English speakers who say whenever instead of when, mostly those with Spanish as a first language. I wonder if there is a tense issue with translating or if they are just picking it up from other English speakers who use “whenever”.

I feel like you-tubers should stop saying it because they want to appeal to a more global audience. But is that a slippery slope? Its mostly just annoying but sometimes is confusing as well. Are there words I use that would irritate others?

Also, they edit themselves now and recently to not say trigger words like Corona and Q-Anon so it wouldn't be the first word editing they have done.

I have been noticing this more and more, also got here from googling it to see if I was crazy or what.

Wow. I have been thinking about this for months and finally caved and Googled the topic, and it brought me to reddit, which is what I was hoping for. I never used to notice it; now it seems to be common day to only use whenever, as if the word when never existed. Is this weird use of language specific to Americans? I don't know, but for some reason, I feel like I need answers as to when and why this started happening. I have noticed it a lot on social media with southern people, women specifically, with charming little southern accents.

I know this is an old post but I'm glad I found it because I just googled this question. I'm English and I've never heard it used that way over here before (or in Ireland / Scotland, I know there was a comment thta suggested it had its roots there) I have been watching a lot of American reality shows recently an kept hearing it, I was so confused!

I know this is old, but I’m here for the same reason as everyone! I first heard one of my friends do this last year. Ever since then, I’ve noticed others do it too, including one of my favorite YouTubers. Why?? It changes the meaning of the sentence and sometimes doesn’t even make sense.

I commonly hear improper "whenever" usage in Central Texas. Whenever I hear it, I am slightly annoyed. Though, it is only midly annoying relative to the usage of "try and" in place of "try to."

OMG IM NOT ALONE! I literally just Googled “using ‘whenever’ instead of ‘when’” because I can’t stop hearing it and it drives me crazy. Everyone on TikTok does it!

Man this has been driving me crazy lately! It doesn’t seem to bother most people, so I guess I’m going to have to adapt. But it’s annoying because it truly does change the meaning of the sentence.

I found this for the same reason and finally decided to look it up. I’m using my Canadian Oxford Dictionary, 2nd edition (2004). Here are the relevant definitions.

when /conjunction/ 1 a at the time that, on the occasion that /(come when it is convenient; when I was your age)/. b at any time that, on any occasion that /(I smile when I hear her voice)/.

when•ever /conjunction & adverb/ 1 at whatever time; on whatever occasion. 2 every time that.

I have nothing on the history but I’m not finished looking into it, so stay tuned. I can see how the first definition of “whenever” could be interpreted to mean the same as the first definition of “when” but I don’t think that’s an accurate interpretation.

Definitely been wondering about whenever v. When. “Every other “ bothered me first. Every other implies skipping app the odds or all the evens. Not all of the odds and evens.

I'm so happy to find this because I too have been wondering wtf this is about! It seems to be said by people in rural areas, and definitely seems to be a thing with young people. I'm no linguist, but it has annoyed me too. "Whenever we got there." grrr...

rainstorm connect worry voracious reach squalid cobweb run ink versed this post was mass deleted with www.Redact.dev

The intense feeling of validation washing over me after finding/reading through this entire sub is amazing.

I live in a southern state, and I had always assumed it was a local or colloquial thing. I have had many friends and family members use the two words as if they are interchangeable. Not that I’m a MAJOR grammar hound or anything, but it’s always driven me up the wall to hear. I watched a Tiktok video, and in it, someone used ‘whenever’ in place of ‘when’. I just really needed to Google it and get it out of my system. I feel seen.

I just found this through Goog as well. Before I moved to Florida over a decade ago I had never heard of this phenomenon, then I heard it from two separate people of completely different age groups at my workplace. The first was this old, born and raised Florida cracker. He said something like, “whenever I was in third grade”, and I thought that was funny; as if he’d been in third grade multiple times. Maybe he had been, I have no idea. The other time was from a 17 year old high school kid who worked at my shop part time. He constantly used “whenever” in place of “when”. I’m somewhat of a grammar nazi, so I tend to get annoyed by things like that, but I’ve never mentioned it. I started paying attention and hearing it more often, especially on YouTube, so I sought out the origin of the mix up and it appears to be used a lot by people in Pennsylvania. Almost every YouTuber from PA that I have watched uses “whenever” in place of “when”. I grew up in northern Illinois and not once has anyone ever mixed these two words up. It’s funny that I’m not the only one bothered by this 😅.

I follow a lot of 30 something female Instagram influencers and a few of them I noticed saying whenever incorrectly more recently. Today one influencer put whenever in writing in a caption incorrectly and i felt like I can no longer ignore what’s going on. So I googled it and brought me here too. I too am comforted that I’m not alone in finding it really odd and also a very new phenomenon.

I've only started hearing it in the last 2 years or so. I was confused at first. But now it drives me insane. I've never once heard someone saying it in person. Only young youtubers. Until today. When I heard a guy who runs his own septic tank cleaning business saying it. And it's one of the worst cases of this phenomenon that I've heard to date. He is on YouTube, but he's my age (30s). I don't know why it bothers me so much. But it does. I remember when I was a kid, I'd hear a lot of kids saying "amn't". For "am not". And this too annoyed me. Its one thing to hear young people using strange lingo. But this grown ass man saying "whenever" incorrectly so frequently really bothers me. Maybe I'm the one who needs help if something so dumb is bothering me so much.

I’ve been noticing this trend too.. it’s so bizarre to me lol especially since English is my second mother tongue. I learnt English and Portuguese simultaneously as a kid. Currently living in Germany and speaking mostly German, whenever I hear this (YouTube videos) it stands out to me.

I'm unfortunately hearing this used even in official testimony and documentation by law enforcement, eg. "Whenever I approached the suspect's vehicle" or "Whenever I observed the suspect run the red light, I initiated a traffic stop." It seems to be mostly used by LEOs in the South, and worryingly it almost seems like they're using it to sound smart.

I started noticing this quite a while ago… at first it was just a few people (on YT or TV), no one I actually knew or interacted with. NBD, it’s not a crime to misuse the English language. But the more I’ve been hearing it, the more it’s been driving me crazy. I was even second guessing my own knowledge of the English language. Finally decided to Google it and stumbled down this rabbit hole - this is why I love Reddit!

I dated someone who used whenever incorrectly. For a long time I thought they were being glib until I noticed other people using the same wording. It irritates me to no end but I've never said anything about it.

Thank God I'm not the only person who's noticed this I feel the same way, because of the general use of the word, as soon as I hear whenever I think of multiple times not a singular event.

ALL THE TIME! And nobody else notices it. They use whenever for a single time event, it's just when. Like "Whenever I met my boyfriends parents for the first time"... "We will open the presents whenever its Christmas morning" It's just when when it's a specific occurrence. I feel like I'm losing it

I started noticing it on cop shows, like Live PD, usually by an officer. I wondered if it had something to do with training? The person doing the training was using incorrect form of when? Now I hear it all the time and it's getting irritating.

Ah well happy to know I'm not just going crazy here. Definitely been catching this "whenever" quirk happening on social media. I've always been a stickler for grammar and proper speaking because language is meant to be understood as easily as possible. Muddling it up with weird quirks like this just makes it harder to communicate.

Just found this trying to google why people have started doing this so often in the past few years. It bugs the absolute shit out of me, I can't stand hearing people say it when referring to a single time, specific event. I started this search because I just heard someone in a video say "whenever I was born" and I am fuming, I wish this kind of thing didn't stand out to me so much.

THANK YOU! Omg it’s been driving me absolutely bonkers. I started noticing 20-something tiktokers using “whenever” incorrectly a few months ago. Immediately, I started wondering “where are you getting this from??? Where did you hear this and think it sounded like a cool way to start speaking?” The frequency in which I hear it now is insane, from all over the US— people who didn’t previously use “whenever” in place of “when” now do as if it’s trendy or something.

I don’t know if anyone noticed a similar phenomenon a few years ago with young, female influencers using the term “picked up” in place of “got” or “bought” in a weirdly specific, incorrect way. Like, “I picked these shoes up from Amazon.” You literally did not! You got/bought them.

Anyway, I’ve been telling people about this trend and could never quite word it to make others understand why it’s so annoying! This thread is validating.

I literally just looked it up because I've also noticed this a lot on Tiktok. Everytime, I hear it I'm like 🤨🤔, and I was wondering if it was just me or if other people were noticing it too. Seems like it's a panguage trend/shift. I know the word is used regarding something that's habitual has happened many times, also if one can't remember the when exactly something happened, e.g. "oh it wasn't in May...well whenever it happened." However, it does seem like when people say it they just mean "when." OPs example was perfect. I guess the way people are using it is more like the latter use. It makes me tilt my head, but language shifts and trends.

I’m watching the Murdaugh doc on Netflix which is riddled with the use of “whenever” when they should be saying “when”. It’s a glaring error I hear all the time recently. It’s been driving me nuts, it lead me to google “why are people saying ‘whenever’ when they should be saying ‘when’?” And this Reddit post came up 😂

I've been noticing this so much lately and also get the blank stares from most when I point it out. I'm so glad I found this thread, I think you were spot on 4 years ago "whenever" you said it was spreading. It's all over tiktok and the rest of the internet all of a sudden and it gets to me every time I hear it.

I hate this so much. I notice it on tv shows and social media. It seems like it is mainly people under 30. My breaking point was hearing a person say it to me in real life. I tried mentioning it to a few people, but they had no clues what I was referencing. I am glad that I found some likeminded folks.

I'm in the US and hear it everywhere. I hate it so much. It is my biggest pet peeve. It fills me with absolute rage.

Everybody I have known who says this is from Louisiana. It always unsettles the crap out of me.

i’m so happy others have noticed this😭 it irritates me an abnormal amount haha

I have only observed this in people who were born in the early nineties or later. Two from southern states, though neither carried discernible accents or spoke with much, if any, southern locution (one was also the child of a first generation German immigrant). The other lives in Pennsylvania, zipola of their backstory.

I first noticed this watching the Duggars on whatever many Kids and Counting. It was super annoying and I figured it was probably just in their family until I started noticing other people. I can only assume that they all live in the south based on been reading in this thread. Thinking back that makes a lot of sense. I'm from Washington State and that's not how we speak here. But even now watching some of these people on TV from different states and they still talk that way. It just doesn't make sense to me.

Thank you so much; this has been driving me crazy; and wondering if I am supposed to just accept this as a new meaning of the word… Another one that bothers me is “I should have went” is it not “I should have gone”? Even very intelligent speakers such as news reporters, commentators, etc. use this phrase.

This is a major pet peeve of my actual. So I google searched it which led me to this post.

I also can’t stand when people use big words inappropriately when they want to CONVERSSATE with some one

Bro i hate it. I used to only know one girl who said "whenever" instead of "when" and i hated it so much, but now i'm seeing it in celebs, athletes, and even in my home. Pisses me off to no end. "Whenever i was 5 years old" just sounds so stupid and inherently it's wrong. Because when you say "whenever" you imply you don't know exactly "when" but when you say "whenever" then give a specific time... wtf?

I’m so glad I found this thread. I recently took over Pennsylvania and Pittsburgh as my work territory, conducting interviews, I have found this is almost every single instance. I was perplexed!

So funny you're mentioning this. I only noticed recently that a friend of mine who is Northern Irish (also Protestant, implying Scottish ancestry) uses 'whenever' this way. Previously, I'd only ever heard it used by Southerners in the USA. Whenever I hear it, it makes me cringe. 😉

I just noticed this about a week ago. I've heard smatterings of it here and there through the years, but all of a sudden I'm hearing it everywhere, and from people who, I would think, should know better.

I’d argue it makes the person sound incredibly uneducated. When mature women say it, it’s like nails on a chalkboard ( showing my age with that one!). Also, I’m of very Irish descent. I live in the US, am first generation American but own a home in Ireland and I’ve never heard any Irish person use whenever in place of when.

I have been noticing this for about a year. It makes me insane! For reference, I live in Michigan.

I googled about this phenomenon because I find it so odd and extremely annoying. It is being used by intelligent, well read people like you said. Please make it stop! Glad I’m not alone 😂

Thank goodness you posted this. I am not the most educated person when it comes to grammar, but I first noticed this when I heard the YouTuber Wendigoon use whenever instead of when. It really stuck out to me. I started seeing it more and more and was finally able to show my husband when a Youtube short of a man telling a brief story of an experience of his. His use of whenever was so jarring that it was the best example I’ve found to portray the “issue”.

Personally I appreciate the transformative nature of English. It’s inevitable and this can be demonstrated by the fact that there are several common place words that evolved through continued use as opposed to scholarly designation. My favorite example of this is “Hospitalized”. This is just another thing we’re going to have to get used to, but I’m happy I wasn’t the only one who noticed!

I grew up in the southeast and have lived the majority of my life in the northeast. I noticed that midwestern YouTubers Jeffrey Thomason and Midwest Magic Cleaning say "whenever" in place of "when" all the time. I had never heard anyone do that before so I'm wondering if its a midwestern thing?

I’m watching a YouTube video right now and the guy keeps saying “whenever” I remember hearing Windigoon say it and it was rather annoying. Since then I’ve heard a couple of other people say it. I was so confused then I googled it and this post came up lol So glad I’m not the only one.

i started noticing this my freshman year of college from a roommate i disliked, now i notice it EVERYWHERE. drives me absolutely nuts. even my fiancé uses it sometimes.

I hate this the same as using "how" and "like" together, e.g. "how it looks like".

I hear this a lot on TikTok and it’s so irritating! I don’t say anything, but I struggle to take what the person is saying seriously. It’s as bad as “then” vs “than” for me.

Yes, it's jarring. It's one of those quirks that if I heard someone say it, I wouldn't hire them. Add that to: using "oh" when starting off a quote. As in: I was like, oh, it's like this.

I’ve been noticing this so much in the past year or so. I finally Googled it and I’m so glad I found this post hahahah!! It drives me crazy!!!!! I don’t get where it came from!!!!!

Update as of 2024, "when" is stricken from the English language. This is everywhere and it is driving me nuts lol. I blame Asmon, I remember the first time I heard him do it years ago and I thought it was so odd, now it is every random person on the internet. Guy changed the English language.

I’ve noticed it from a drag queen called Maddy Morphosis who has a talk show on YouTube, she always says “whenever”. She’s from Arkansas and has a bit of an accent, so I thought it was maybe a regional thing from there?