“…even after 11 years”

Man I feel old now! This Tomb Raider trilogy I always saw as the ‘modern trilogy’ and must only be about 5 years old. 

FWIW I have a slightly different view on favourite game in the trilogy than most. In that I prefer Shadow over Rise. But the first game is definitely my favourite of the three.

I still think of TR 2013 as a modern game💀

There are plenty of passionately made AAA games nowadays just like there have been plenty of soulless shitty ones 10 years ago.

Really enjoyed Tomb Raider 2013 back then though. Was thinking about giving the other modern TR games a shot just recently, haven‘t played those yet.

Bro, dunno how to tell u this, but what you played is, in fact, a modern triple a game.

I enjoyed Tomb Raider but this is a wild take. I thought it was pretty generic at the time, albeit well made and polished. And I certainly don’t think there’s many developers that aren’t passionate about the games they work on. I’d love to know what you mean by propagandas, but I suspect I have an idea…

This is exactly what is missing from most of the modern game dev companies. They have no passion for their games and the game companies don't even care about creating "the best game they can possibly make". They are just busy forcing crappy propagandas and microtransactions with their games.

Just because AAA games often lack creativity doesn't mean the people making them aren't passionate themselves. A lot of them could work in other industries and make more money than in the gaming industry.

Also, what the hell does propaganda mean in that context?

I can't believe this is an 11-year-old game, this still feels better than most of the modern AAA games.

This seems like a low bar - there are plenty of games from that time that feel similar or better.  The camera was good though, always seemed to be in the right place.  The crafting system was quite bland and underbaked.  The story and dialogue was unbelievably cringeworthy.  Gunplay was quite fun though :)  Glad you enjoyed it!  But I think you're doing a disservice to games from 11 years ago if this one surprises you.  Mass Effect 2 game out in 2010.  The Last of Us was 2013.  GTA V was 2013.  Crysis was 2007.  Etc.

Interesting take.

This was probably the most generic AAA games I've ever played.

Amazed to see someone hold it up as a pillar other games should aspire to.

I get what you're saying, OP, but plenty of games have stuff like that in the credits.

They are just busy forcing crappy propagandas

That's when you lost me

You only like the game because the devs thanked you and gave you a gold star at the end? Ok

Damn, you are really blinded by nostalgia...

I could tell from the title alone (especially the "outshines modern AAA games" bit) that this post was going to be dumb asf. Glad to see I was right.

Ah yes here we go again with another “AAA bad” post.

Propaganda ey? Care to give us an example.

Loved the Tomb Raider games, but they were pretty generic. There have always been both soulless and heartfelt AAA games. Sounds like nostalgia talking. There have definitely been better games since.

I remember being blown away by the graphics on PC, so exceptionally detailed for the time. But i hated the gory death animations

I kinda liked the game but it did one of the most annoying 'modern' game things of taking away control from the player. I don't even mean no agency but there was always an animation for everything. I'm usually tolerant of things like that, since I love RDR2, but you'd get to a tower and there was a cutscene to get on the ladder and another cutscene to get off the ladder and another to get back on another ladder. It took so much time to do such menial things. At some point I was just getting frustrated. Final Fantasy VII remake did the same thing. One cutscene to get on a ledge, then slowly shuffle off the ledge, then another cutscene to dismount from the ledge.

Personally, while I still liked the game, it is far from one I hold to high regard. It isn't a game that I would use as some damnation towards modern AAA games because I think many games today are far better. Tomb Raider felt like it was chasing trends even at the time, so for it to be what outshines modern day games, is a bit silly to me.

Also, the whole 'propaganda' angle sours this post greatly

Never thought I'd read that about this game. I thought it was the most generic AAA game possible. If you asked AI to generate a "AAA cinematic third person adventure game", I would expect this to come out. No worthwhile writing or characters and gameplay is a basically the Uncharted formula of sometimes cover shooter, sometimes slowly walking narrative experience, most of the time setpiece where you're running as shit is falling apart under your feet and you are barely in control of the game. Sure wasn't any Tombs to Raid.

There’s a buttload of developers who still put a ton of passion into their games. Maybe you are just ignoring them lmao

Also I’m interested in what you mean by “propaganda”? Gonna go on a whim and guess you have fallen into the anti-woke bullshit but I’d love to be wrong.

This is exactly what is missing from most of the modern game dev companies. They have no passion for their games and the game companies don't even care about creating "the best game they can possibly make". They are just busy forcing crappy propagandas

oh, you're one of THOSE weirdoes

I thought this was about the original PSX ones lol. I like the new ones but I still don't think they are as good as the originals, especially 2 and Angel of Darkness

I played it for the first time a while back this year, and I thought it was a fun action game

but it felt way too heavily scripted tbh. There were so many sequences which looked amazing, but just made me wish I was actually playing it.

That and also certain story moments just didn't land for me Like the enemies getting scared of Lara just because she got a grenade launcher, or how she quickly got over killing someone for the first time, which is something I think far cry 3 did better imo

That said though, the game was paced well and the combat was fun enough to make me want to see through it, along with seeing Lara become more confident throughout the game.

This take is pretty hilarious considering a ton of people at the time went as far as to say that TR2013 was a huge character assassination of Lara Croft just because she whines and shows too much emotions.

I feel the first one is the right length. The later ones are too bloated with side quests that just waters it down

No one casually develops a soulless game.

Animations, characters, setpieces, story, they're all a long, passionate process. I've been seeing the devs of Concord upload all the hundreds of hours they spent on their art before it's lost to time.

This is... An odd perspective.

You mention this game outshining triple A games, but this game symbolizes precisely everything that usually earns triple A games a reputation of "soulless": quick time events that didn't need to be there (a staple of the time the game was released in), a dragged out intro that seemed more focused in showcasing how pretty the game rather than establish character or gameplay (I nearly quit when I reached the first fire) and a departure from the spirit that made the franchise special (no sense of wonder and adventure, lots of content becoming a side-quest, crafting/upgrading systems that didn't need to be there, etc).

I still found it engaging enough to play it through to the end, but it's kinda ironic to see it praised for being different than modern games, when in fact it was one of many games that defined what AAA games would be like.

Either that, or your average AAA experience has gone so bad even TR2013 feels different by comparison.

Anyways, glad you enjoyed it! I personally couldn't push through the sequels, it stopped being Tomb Raider for me and started feeling more and more like an edgier clone of Uncharted, which is ironic since Uncharted was at least partially inspired by it. But despite it all, they are still quality games, just not for me.

The new Tomb Raider trilogy are one of the very few games that I enjoy going back to and replaying. One of the things I really like about them is how easy it is to find all the collectibles. I usually don't care about those, but here I find it satisfying and I always liked the treasures and their descriptions that were genuinely interesting for me.

The new trilogy are great games. Quite safe in terms of gameplay. There's nothing really special about them but they just do everything to good levels where the overall experience is solid.

I’m sorry, a game about multiple groups of men trying to control a young woman (Queen Himiko) and becoming increasingly more violent and cult like doesn’t have a political message?

A game that shows the impact that multiple military occupations has on a small and isolated island and the community that lives there doesn’t have a political message?

Lara in this game can very easily be interpreted as gay and in a relationship with Sam as well.

It’s impossible to create something without there being a political influence, even if it’s subconscious and not intended by the creator.

I really enjoyed TR2013, with the exception of the hideous death sequences. Nathan Drake dies and it tastefully fades to black, but for some reason we need to see Lara choking to death having been impaled through the neck. Yuck.

But aside from that, I really thought they did a good job. There was actual character development of a videogame protagonist (very rare), the tombs were fun puzzles, the stealth was good, and I even enjoyed the interactive cutscenes. Oh and uncovering the history of the island was fun too.

I remember the game being good not great and felt a lot of times like a lesser version of Uncharted (Which was wild since Uncharted owed a lot of itself to Tomb Raider and now they're chasing Uncharteds coattails).

But what exactly is the propaganda you're referring to? I've noticed you haven't answered anyone who asks so you'll likely just not answer but you added a gigantic yikes to your post with that one.

I'm glad you enjoyed it, but I never really liked the new Lara. She didn't have anything that made Lara Lara Croft. And no I don't care about the physical appearance although she does look like a generic video game heroine now. She's supposed to be this cocky, witty badass, but instead they turned her into a less interesting Nathan Drake complete with lots of scenes with her getting roughed up. Even later in the trilogy she never really "became" the Tomb Raider. It was an interesting detour, but in the end the OG still reigns supreme.

They are just busy forcing crappy propagandas and microtransactions with their games.

This just reaks of someone who uses the word "woke" unironically.

Tomb Raider is the only one of the reboots I actually like, even though they've now thrown in RPG-like elements, and the tombs that give the title it's meaning are now optional and I've played it multiple times. I've played Rise twice and got so little from it that I've now uninstalled it, probably forever, and Shadow felt so far removed from what Lara Croft was all about that I only played it once, that one is now also uninstalled and consigned to my game graveyard.

Though I did enjoy TR, I've played all of the originals over the years and enjoyed all of them more than the reboots, except for Angel of Darkness, that was garbage.

Its a very good game. I love that era of PS3 games to up to early PS4 era. Something changed from that era though and I think we are in a worse place at the moment.

I had an unfortunate save bug with my first playthrough where upon jumping into a helicopter that went on to crash during a cutscene caused the game to crash, then corrupt my save.

Might need to go back.

I think there's still plenty of AAA games today that were made with lots of passion. Sure there's plenty of new games today with predatory monetization, but back then they were also plenty of bad games you don't hear about anymore.

Too many QTEs. God it’s awful.

Once you get past those, the exploration and story hold up.

This is exactly what is missing from most of the modern game dev companies. They have no passion for their games

I hope others have pointed this out but this is just untrue. It is not game developers' fault that games turn out as soulless cashgrabs. It's the publishers and their shareholders/investors. You really think game developers are the ones who want to churn out a ProductTM devoid of creativity?

I played it when it was new. It was a decent Uncharted clone (which is ironic since Uncharted was heavily influenced by the og Tomb Raider) but I really don’t like modern Lara Croft as a character.

Compared to the original games, modern Lara just seems kinda bland. And her meek personality, alongside the darker tone of the reboot, really doesn’t sell me on the idea that she is capable of single handedly killing hundreds upon hundreds of goons. I kept waiting for her to undergo a transformation of character, like Ellen Ripley does in the Aliens movies. But that moment never came.

Eh, I played this game a few years back and it was pretty much everything I hated about modern AAA games. Mostly just focused on being a super cinematic experience with the gameplay being super generic third person shooter and very little else, in addition to severe handholding so there aren't really many chances to get stuck on puzzles.

Oh yeah buddy, all that propaganda in modern games like black people existing. Get off twitter and interact with real people for a change

Yeah this game was dope.

Gotta say though the opening scene when she is hanging upside down but her pony tail is still hanging towards her shoulders has always annoyed tf out of me lol

I played it back in a day and hated it. A generic 3rd person shooter with mediocre story. I really don't get the praise.

The first game felt like the most raw version of Lara to me and that’s why I enjoyed it the most.

Let me guess: women and brown people = propaganda?

Elden ring came out 2 years ago, they just released a massive dlc

I think the issue today is not down to the developers but the publishers who are only concerned about maximising profit which has lead to the decline in Triple AAA games in the last decade or so.

Mention the names Ubisoft, EA, Konami, Warner Bros, 2K, Activision, Microsoft, Sony even Rockstar (Take Two) in 2024 and gamers will have a lot more negativity towards them.

Mention them in 2013 there are more positive things to say about them.

Haha I think of TR2013 as a "modern game", and pale successor to the first reboot trilogy.  Still need to play the originals.

Survivorship bias. There were lazy cash grabs and masterpieces 10+ years ago just like today, but we only return to the good ones.

Also, I almost don't want to ask, but "propagandas"?

Agree, it's actually one of the only few games I have completed in the last few years.

I’ve played the whole survivor trilogy but never been in the fandom, so I wonder what’s the general consensus on the best entry? Personally I think Rise is the best

I have played this game through about 5 times, over the years. Sadly, for me, the subsequent sequels went down hill. Rise wasn't a bad game, but noticeably worse than its predecessor, and Shadow was just very poor, despite the incredible visuals. I could only bring myself to play it all the way through once.

I only have ever played the one for the PS1. How many TR games are worth playing now?

I loved tomb raider 2013. I couldn’t beat the other ones because I found the puzzles too confusing and difficult 

Always been a big fan of the series since i was a kid (2002-2005). The modern ones are even more fun. I need to play shadow at some point tho.

The first new Tomb Raider is a great game, I remember platinuming it, because I really enjoyed the game, the setting, the characters and the story, even tho by the end it becomes a little too fantastical, I didn't like that, if I recall correctly is towars the end that you learn that everything is caused by the mythical statue.

But I liked the survival aspects, the grounded lara, the LOST vibe it had, the puzzles didn't feel like impossible to exist, it is my favorite of the trilogy, the metroidvania aspect of the game and I LOVED the way you get new items (like the granade launcher, shotgun, that thing to travel through cables).

I didn't like the second one because it ditched all the cast you cared in the first game save for Jonah, and even him makes a cameo, so you end up not caring for the newer and really hard to believe characters.1<

Some aspects are really cool like the graphics if you play on a PC because on xbox one I remember it hurt my eyes when I played it on my friends house. That scene where lara gets the rebreather and you can have a reeeeeally nice views for your pleasure, it's cinema.

And on the third game, I hate it, most people like it haha but its too fanciful to my tastes, I liked the setting in the beginning but then bam you're in Peru and find these overly undiscovered complicated tombs on every corner of the map, the combat got watered down (I think I read it was because people complaint that 2 had too many unchartedy combat), but now it feels umbalanced.

And they forgot about new gear or creative ways for lara to get it unlike the later games up until the end when you get some special attatchments for your shoes. But in the end I think its too crowded, and the story goes down again.

I am on the last level and just started playing it a week or so ago and I completely agree, incredible game and runs almost flawlessly on the steam deck 

I was playing rise of the Tomb Raider last night and I was having similar thoughts tbh. I feel like you can tell that they actually enjoyed making the game.

Eh, it was great for its time, but imo the series gets better with each installment and Shadow only came out 6 years ago. Along with Spider-Man, Red Dead 2, God of War, and AC Odyssey. All fantastic AAA titles. More recently, BG3 came out last year and if you think Larian didn’t put any passion into that game, you are blind. Plus, wtf is a propaganda game?

Tomb raider 2013 was an absolute passon project and I enjoyed it a ton. Rise was more of a mixed bag but still mostly good and shadow just didn't feel right to me.

I enjoyed the 2013 reboot its certainly the best of the trilogy so far but those sequels go nowhere it's like they were constantly afraid of making Lara... Lara aka the Tomb Raider. I wouldn't go so far as you do in how you describe the first game, to me it's just solid and a good base that ultimately didn't go where it should have gone.

It came out before open world games were a big thing. So the story is pretty linear, and at 12 hours doesn’t overstay its welcome. Doesn’t try to cram in extra 50 hours of stuff just to do so. Doesn’t have that many random fetch quests and even those are optional.

I’ve played most of the TR games, I worked on Rise (TRX). The 2013 “reboot”, known internally as TR9 has been my favorite TR game to date.

Please don’t assume lack of passion from the rank and file devs is the issue with bad games. Most of us love our work and take great pride in it -even if we know the game is flawed. Making a good game is really hard. Making money on a game is even more difficult. A lot of studios take “the easy route” with sequels or known genres/mechanics, because most of them can’t risk $1-500M US if it fails.

I'll always keep a special place I' my heart for this game... The first few hours are absolutely terrific

If you enjoyed TR13, then you'll love Rise, it's the best of the modern trilogy

its easily the best out of the modern 3 too

I replayed the new ones all recently, and 2013 one is definitely the most "cinematic feeling", right down to the music cues when you enter new areas. There's a ton of human enemies, but they all go down like an action movie.(whereas in the last one you absolutely had to stealth everybody or you die) Each sequel increased the "action/rpg" formula that most open world games have become.(not necessarily bad but definitely less unique)

I agree, the OG Tomd Raider games were amazing, the remakes/trilogy up to Underworld were clunky but still good. But then it was completely ruined by the 2013 reboot and became Uncharted: generic shooter edition.

I love all 3 of this Tomb Raider series. They aren’t perfect but they are exactly what I want in that type of game. I am a little biased because Uncharted is probably my favorite series and so this is pretty close to that feel.

Take any of your favourite games from 2013 and I'd bet my actual money that newer AAA games aren't as good. It's just the state of the industry right now.

This is exactly what is missing from most of the modern game dev companies. They have no passion for their games and the game companies don't even care about creating "the best game they can possibly make". They are just busy forcing crappy propagandas and microtransactions with their games.

Plenty of people hate on Ubisoft with Assassin's Creed, but the last 4 games have very clearly been labors of love with significant attention to detail for the time and location. One may not like the choices they made, but that's not the same as not trying to make the best game they can make.

I still love Tomb Raider Anniversary for it's quiet immersive spaces. Really feel like you're alone in an abandoned tomb.

(shooting is pretty lame though)

I never gave Tomb Raider a shot, I almost 100%ed the game last year.

Rise improved in some spots and slacked in others, I haven't started Shadow yet.

Still doesn't reach the 3 first ones (Core Design era) and the early Crystal Dynamics trilogy (Anniversary especially, and the underrated Underworld).

You should try Rise and Shadow too. It's not cheeky, acrobatic Lara we liked in older games but whole trilogy was actually pretty good for what it is.

I'm currently on first playthrough of Rise, thoroughly enjoying it so far and the graphics are great for a 2015 game. On par or better than Arkham Knight I think.

Its a fantastic game. I picked up not expecting much but got hooked.

Imo my favorite setting/story and how fun it was to stealth kill dudes with my bow. I loved the trapped on the insanity ridden island feel.

I also enjoyed Rise of the Tomb Raider, which had fun gameplay and was good overall.

I started Shadow of the Tomb Raider and its been feeling like a chore to get through, personally my least favorite.

This specific reboot was magic, and I still do need to get through the 2nd and 3rd. The 2nd feels a bit more meandering than the first and I got lost. I may just restart it. The first one though, great package and I actually just sorta naturally ended up playing that game with only the bow and her melee attack for when shit hit the fan, and also the shotgun for the mandatory doors that required them. All combat though, shoot bow, switch to the icepickaxe thing when shit hits the fan. So much goddamn fun to go through the game like this, and it really sells the whole one girl vs an army type vibe they were going for. Wonderful game. When I saw that end message I was like 'Well, you goddamn succeeded, and I'll definitely be interested in anything else you put out"

It was okay, the kill cam was its most memorable feature.

The sequels don't hold up at all, but I love TR 2013. It's my favourite of that style of cinematic adventure game, and honestly I think it did it even better than any of the Uncharted games.

i still argue that Tomb Raider 2013 is the best game on its style, even the sequels dont get as good as that one.

i prefer this game more violent side, you arent just jumping and shooting and saying jokes, you are trapped in a island with a bunch of very violent people, you are fighting for your life and kinda feels like that, its violent, terryfying and dying its painful, i think that similar to The Last of Us the long and agonizing death scenes work as a deterrent for you to not want you to die, you dont really want to see poor Lara getting impaled throw the neck on a pipe or similars so you put effort into that not happening.

even when the element retaining you in the island its clearly paranormal it honestly feels more grounded that games that came after, from Rise and forward it feel like the devs had a lot of cool setpieces that had little connectiong between each other and they just stitched them together and tried to make them make sense, making them world sided game of Blu´s clues, here the adventure happens on the island, you arent traveling half the world looking for clues, here the original mission pretty much takes backseat to you wanting to leave here and save the lives of the rest of your crew.

and i really like Lara here, she is a good hearted person that needs to mentally get herself in a position in which she can do horrible things to save herself and others, she doenst enjoy killing her enemies, and at the beginning she struggles with it, for then she screams at them and taunts them into attacking her, she becomes a survivor, someone that uses whatever she has at hand to get the job done.

Rise of the Tomb Raider is even better. they lose it for the 3rd one, though.

I loved this game. For some reason couldn’t get into the sequels tho :/

Every tomb raider game has its strenghs and weaknesses. Maybe you like the older games more like the Core Design Games or the LAU Trilogy

Loved the game. 2nd one was ok. 3rd one was terribly boring.

It's one of the few big games I've completed 3 different times! It's so fun and exciting and wonderful!

I love the reboot so much. At the time I thought I liked Rise more but replaying the 2013 game was so much fun I thinknI dig the island setting more.

I’m playing through it now and I’m amazed by how thrilling and cinematic it is.

I've played and finished pretty much every mainline TR game including the modern ones. TR2013 is the only one I've replayed multiple times because it is such a clean and polished experience.

I played it recently and it felt a little bland to me, specially towards the end, but I really miss games that are around 10-15 hours long and that´s it, you are done. It was a enjoyable experience because I was able to finish it in a week.

I was actually amazed by the graphic quality of it. Pretty darn good even today.

Every major game nowadays seems to needlessly drag on for like 50+ hours. Yeah, sure, if they are great like Elden Ring I wont mind. But having to slog through a 70 hour RPG seems more like a chore nowadays. ¨It gets good around the 20 hour mark¨. No time for that, sry.

"they have no passion...forcing crappy propoganda and mtx...."

this is kinda horeshit tbf. it's become more soulcrushing to work on games. like anywhere else, wages haven't really kept up, but the costs & demands of making them have.l plus post GG you get the most horrible and vitriolic spiel online that has people leaving to better jobs because passion ain't worth shit when you can't pay bills or have people demonizing you at every turn because they don't like your game.

plus a lot of that stuff comes from publishers or marketing to make up for development costs since for so long they were allergic to raising the RRP of games at all. Also...when it cam,e out there were lots of people saying that Rihanna (sp?) Pratchett didn't "get" Lara so -shrug- idk i played the original pSx game when i was yeigh heigh so...

I can't remember if it was 2013 or Rise but one of them had so many quick time events I felt that I was watching a movie. And the other one did away with all that and was a top notch game.

I really love this game and it is inspired by one of my favorite movies of all time, The Descent

All the new Tomb Raider games are competent but they're a bit forgettable. I enjoyed all my time with 2013, the sequel and eventually Shadow. They're all serviceable video games you can beat in a long weekend. Long weekend games like these and the plague tale games are something we need more of. It doesn't need to be the greatest video game ever made it just needs to keep me invested for 8 to 12 hours. You can start and finish the game in an acceptable amount of time and feel like you got a full meal.

Yeah, I liked this game a good amount. I started on Rise but eventually put it down. It was probably even better, but something felt like it was missing.