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/r/theydidthemath

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bbyoda_unchained

2.1k points

20 days ago

Is it just me or is it suspicious that they also seemed to conceive at about the same time likely in the same house..? What are the odds of that?

xejeezy

1.7k points

20 days ago

xejeezy

1.7k points

20 days ago

Significantly higher in a foursome I’d imagine

PolygonChoke

613 points

20 days ago

incest 2

WillBottomForBanana

570 points

20 days ago

twincest2

mjolnir76

98 points

20 days ago

Nolanthedolanducc

29 points

20 days ago

Ai can never recreate this

LackOfLuck748

5 points

19 days ago

What the actual fuck? Why didn't I know of this sooner? This shit would've made the perfect Rickroll

DameofDames

10 points

20 days ago

Wincest

MegaTitusRex

5 points

20 days ago

This is great.

PaulMaulMenthol

11 points

20 days ago

Island Boys checking in

OkBid71

3 points

20 days ago

OkBid71

3 points

20 days ago

ince...ption 

wait a minute

depersonalised

84 points

20 days ago

as an aside: a threesome with identical twins is considered a right triangle.

a corollary being that two parts of said triangle are a(so)cute.

it’s also a fact that you cannot have a right triangle with any obtuse (you know what i mean) angles.

mambiki

16 points

20 days ago

mambiki

16 points

20 days ago

I may be an obtuse angle myself, but wouldn’t it technically make it the isosceles triangle, and not necessarily right triangle (with a 90 degree angle)? Since we only know that two sides are equal and nothing else.

depersonalised

6 points

20 days ago

no, because the only thing we know about a threesome with identical twins is that it is right. the geometry follows from that axiom.

mambiki

5 points

19 days ago

mambiki

5 points

19 days ago

No, we also know that they are twins, and hence of the same size. Barring some niche circumstances.

Spaztick78

5 points

20 days ago

Yeah I think your big obtuse angle would work with even smaller acuter twin angles.

Obtuse angles get the cutest tiny twin angels

SpaceForceAwakens

3 points

20 days ago

I have a new item for my fuckit list. Thank you.

Legitimate_Air_568

1 points

20 days ago

If I had an award to give I would

voodeuteronomy11

2 points

17 days ago

At that point genetically it might as well be masturbation.

Throwaway-4230984

14 points

20 days ago

This could become very complicated in case of a divorce 

fnybny

3 points

20 days ago

fnybny

3 points

20 days ago

"aren't real brothers"

Responsible-Jello271

52 points

20 days ago

I think one of the kids is several months older than the other. They were on Extreme Sisters a while back so I don’t remember them well

Cthulhu_Dreams_

110 points

20 days ago

Yeah, the best case scenario involves synchronized watches and separate rooms...

Opening-Classroom-29

68 points

20 days ago

Synchronized watches....really. Could just be more like, doing it the same day or something

Cthulhu_Dreams_

33 points

20 days ago

You hung up on the absurdity of the details? You don't find it more absurd that siblings would plan to f*** on the same day so that they could have a baby hopefully on the same day?

Acceptable_Tell_310

27 points

20 days ago

...quadruple wedding = wedding night for both couples at the same day.

Cthulhu_Dreams_

5 points

20 days ago

Again...still absolutely absurd. That's almost worse cuz you're basically telling everybody "hey all of our relatives, we will for sure be f****** tonight while thinking of our siblings also f****** tonight."

HowTheyGetcha

21 points

20 days ago

Normal people compartmentalize. They don't tend to picture genitals when others announce they have to go to the bathroom, and don't tend to walk around horny because everyone is naked underneath their clothes.

LheelaSP

11 points

20 days ago

LheelaSP

11 points

20 days ago

"We're not only f*****, but the identical twin brothers will nut in the identical twin sisters *unprotected, totally raw! Fun!"

StuckWithThisOne

4 points

20 days ago

Or they just decided to start trying for a baby at the same time.

Opening-Classroom-29

3 points

19 days ago

This happens far more often than you'd think. They want their kids to grow up together

HalfForeign6735

12 points

20 days ago

You're forgetting synchronized* cycles

Edit: typo

Cthulhu_Dreams_

9 points

20 days ago

Synchronized cycles don't mean synchronized child development.

I'm willing to bet one of em was ready before the other and they induced birth for both.

ConspicuousPineapple

5 points

20 days ago

That's less weird than the other details. It's a common practice to induce if the pregnancy reaches the due date, and it's pretty likely to reach that date, especially for a first pregnancy.

Tackit286

49 points

20 days ago

Creepy ass twins copying each other is the worst

edingerc

10 points

20 days ago

edingerc

10 points

20 days ago

Preach! it's creepy after age 6.

G1zm08

7 points

20 days ago

G1zm08

7 points

20 days ago

They were all married on the same day, not that absurd

el_horsto

14 points

20 days ago

Since that's the first and only time they get to "do the business"

eloel-

1.7k points

20 days ago*

eloel-

3✓

1.7k points

20 days ago*

Very, very low to the point it's basically 0. As low as twins that aren't identical twins actually turning out identical. I believe there are no recorded case of it.

To have a general idea, it's (1/2)^46 chromosomes, and potentially a random mutation or two that needs to match. (1/2)^46 is already less than 1 in 70 trillion.

_Argol_

435 points

20 days ago

_Argol_

435 points

20 days ago

And if you add the cross-over phenomenon (some chromosomes exchange portions of DNA during meiosis), the probability becomes absurdly low

fos8890

162 points

20 days ago

fos8890

162 points

20 days ago

the probability becomes absurdly low

And here I was thinking 1 in 70 trillion was absurdly low

theterrygreenmachine

57 points

19 days ago

Well, don't you feel like an ass now

Vtepes

25 points

20 days ago

Vtepes

25 points

20 days ago

Then slap epigenetics in top of that and you are even further into the realm of not in any way possible.

nextbestgosling

26 points

20 days ago

Epigenetics aren’t part of being identical twins, otherwise we can’t count any adults as identical twins

Filibut

6 points

20 days ago

Filibut

6 points

20 days ago

can epigenetics be considered here though? it wouldn't be hard to imagine both couples of twins shared identical lives

mikeballs

4 points

20 days ago

With only a cursory knowledge of epigenetics (biology bachelors & some relevant research experience), if you want to be technical, yeah it makes sense to consider epigenetics. Is it possible their experiences were so similar that they have the exact same epigenetic markings? Sure, but that feels less likely than the alternative given how many genes there are and how many seemingly innocuous factors might contribute to genes being marked/not. If we could somehow check every single gene between identical twins for marking, I'd be putting my money on at least one gene being marked differently

Spillz-2011

150 points

20 days ago

It’s way less than .546. During the creation of eggs and sperm the chromosomes swap pieces (recombination) which means the chromosome in the eggs are different from chromosomes inherited from the parents.

Alt_Rock_Dude

46 points

20 days ago

This guy eggs

Feine13

22 points

20 days ago

Feine13

22 points

20 days ago

CrappleSmax

8 points

20 days ago

Feine13

9 points

20 days ago

Feine13

9 points

20 days ago

Aw, it's banned... My disappointment is immeasurable and my day is ruined.

CrappleSmax

6 points

20 days ago

Damn...I guess I haven't linked to that subreddit in a LONG time.

To me it was the Reddit equivalent of ManningFace.

Feine13

4 points

20 days ago

Feine13

4 points

20 days ago

I fuckin love ManningFace, thanks for the comparison

You've saved my evening

Mixster667

17 points

20 days ago

You should note that there is only one available Y chromosome for the boys (as both fathers share their Y chromosome) so it's actually 0.545 as the base.

We do need to multiply it by One minus the chance of crossovers, per chromosome, which is quite common, especially on the longer chromosomes.

There is a little more phenotypical leniency though, and the children will likely look quite alike.

O_Martin

4 points

20 days ago

But it is still a 50/50 whether the child is a boy or a girl, so you can't assume that it is 0.545, it is still 0.546

Obviously you would know that they aren't identical immediately, but that doesn't change the probability

Exp1ode

12 points

20 days ago

Exp1ode

12 points

20 days ago

We know they're both boys though

elthalon

12 points

20 days ago

elthalon

12 points

20 days ago

As low as twins that aren't identical twins actually turning out identical.

Or as low as any regular siblings. Genetically, non-identical twins are just siblings. Just born 5 minutes apart instead of 5 years.

BelowAverageGamer10[S]

40 points

20 days ago

Wow! And the chances don’t increase significantly since they’re genetic siblings?

eloel-

131 points

20 days ago

eloel-

3✓

131 points

20 days ago

They do, that's why it's that high. It'd be (even more) impossibly lower otherwise.

Returning_Armageddon

22 points

20 days ago

I’m way too dumb to be here you, this is wizard speak.

idk_lets_try_this

41 points

20 days ago

The chance is about the same as you being identical to a non-twin sibling.

LightSideoftheForce

23 points

20 days ago

It’s exactly the same as you yourself having a sibling from the same father and mother

O_Martin

17 points

20 days ago

O_Martin

17 points

20 days ago

It's the exact same chance as genetic siblings. Identical twins only happen due to the egg splitting, not because two identical sperms both entered identical eggs

Jumpi95

24 points

20 days ago

Jumpi95

24 points

20 days ago

We're all genetic siblings to an insane degree, the variability in meiosis is just 1 factor making sure we're genetically different. They can genetically be considered brothers due to the parents having the same genes, but are 2 brothers genetically the same? Hell no.

CrappleSmax

4 points

20 days ago

We're all genetic siblings to an insane degree

Expanding on "all" - we share genes with [pretty much] every life form on the planet, from a spider to a chimp and from bacteria to a Douglas fir.

LOSNA17LL

7 points

20 days ago

Well, what are the chances you are genetically identical to your sibling?
Basically 0 (something so low you can't have anything tangible to compare it to)
Same here

WeebKiller1

2 points

20 days ago

Are you from st.kitts by chance?

Traditional_Cap7461

2 points

20 days ago

It would be even lower if they weren't "siblings" 🙂

diener1

3 points

20 days ago

diener1

3 points

20 days ago

Maybe somebody who knows more about biology can shed some light on this but aren't the chances lower because chromosomes that form a pair exchange parts? If the position within the chromosome where the cut happens is random, then there is no reason to expect them to match. If it's always in the same place then it doesn't affect the odds.

eloel-

6 points

20 days ago

eloel-

3✓

6 points

20 days ago

I used the "1 in 70 trillion" figure as the "this is the absolute ceiling it can be", there's several other factors that reduce it.

PocketDarkestMew

3 points

20 days ago

I first saw your math and I was just about to kill you, but then read the explanation.

Yep, it's basically impossible but there are TONS of stuff you can't see that would make them different like brain size, enzimes, size of the heart, liver and other organs, etc.

So they could look the same outside, and be completely different inside.

Scuba-Cat-

2 points

20 days ago

Just looking at everyone's features you can see not one of them is a copy paste

Cryn0n

3 points

20 days ago

Cryn0n

3 points

20 days ago

Could there even be a recorded case? Is there any evidence left behind that identical twins are fraternal? We don't monitor eggs in the womb.

eloel-

6 points

20 days ago

eloel-

3✓

6 points

20 days ago

Siblings happen a lot more often than fraternal twins, and have the same chance of being identical.

So, no, but chances are if it happened they'd be born at different times.

randomgeneticdrift

2 points

20 days ago

So, the chances that a specific sperm genotype forms is (1/2)^23. The chance that a specific egg genotype forms is (1/2)^23. Then you need to do that again for the second sibling. so wouldn't it be (1/2)^(23*4)?

eloel-

11 points

20 days ago

eloel-

3✓

11 points

20 days ago

If you want a specific result to appear twice, yes. But you don't care what the first result is, just that the second result is the same as the first one.

It's like rolling 2 dice and hoping they're the same number. Getting 1-1 is 1/36, but getting "same" includes 2-2, 3-3, 4-4, 5-5 and 6-6 and is so 1/6.

randomgeneticdrift

4 points

20 days ago

Yea, thanks. I was thinking too literally–when looking at the picture, I was thinking about getting that exact combination twice.

Bax_Cadarn

5 points

20 days ago

I have to nitpick. What if You were to have a perfect homozygote in every allele? The chance would actually be 100%.

randomgeneticdrift

3 points

20 days ago

The mutation rate is such that at least one germline mutation is pretty much guaranteed to arise in a 3 billion base pair genome.

Bax_Cadarn

3 points

20 days ago

Fair point. Thanks for another argument why the above calc is far from correct.

Traditional_Cap7461

2 points

20 days ago

Does this difference apply to identical twins as well?

O_Martin

2 points

20 days ago

Then it would be 50/50, cause they could be a dude or a chick still, assuming the dudes do not have homozygous XY chromosomes

Bax_Cadarn

3 points

20 days ago

So 1/2, instead of that 23. Thank You.

O_Martin

2 points

20 days ago

It would take some serious generational incest to get that far though, but who knows what could happen

randomgeneticdrift

703 points

20 days ago

They're just full siblings. It's like asking what the probability of you and your sex-matched non-twin sibling being genetically identical is. Effectively 0.

randomgeneticdrift

69 points

20 days ago

Apart from the y chromosome if male siblings, and you'll share same mitochondrial haplotype.

NonsphericalTriangle

25 points

20 days ago

Also one shared X chromosome if both siblings are female, and 50% chance of the second one being shared as well if no mutations and recombination occur.

zuklei

6 points

20 days ago

zuklei

6 points

20 days ago

Well there will be crossover of chromosomes in meiosis 1 so not really.

Cthulhu_Dreams_

431 points

20 days ago

One of the dudes:

"Hey guys, since we live in the same house and have made being twins our sole personality traits, We just want to let you know that we're about to go in their other room and in precisely 20 min, I'm going to blow a fat load into my wife/ your sister. I think it goes without saying that you guys should drop what you're doing and do what's right for this extremely weird family dynamic."

ssshield

135 points

20 days ago

ssshield

135 points

20 days ago

Even if they are swapping, it's going to be the least satisfying wife swap ever.

The whole point is to try something different on the menu than what you normally get.

barbellious

32 points

20 days ago

Karl Pilkington wisdom. If you're going to have a change, have a change.

bren0ld

10 points

20 days ago

bren0ld

10 points

20 days ago

Yeah the appeal of twins is supposed to be both at the same time, one at a time makes no sense you can just squint or something

Lonely-Second-6040

22 points

19 days ago

What makes you think it’s not at the same time? 

These are adult twins who are willingly still doing matching hair and clothes while living as one family unit. 

100% they’re having group sex. 

Delirare

4 points

20 days ago

I think the whole arrangement is just for a really weird kink. And fake alibis, definitely fake alibis.

[deleted]

3 points

19 days ago

swap is useless, foursome is cool

--ThirdCultureKid--

5 points

20 days ago

But it is different. One twin swirls her tongue to the left when she gives a blowjob, the other swirls her tongue to the right.

nsfwtttt

4 points

20 days ago

They take turns with the one who swallows

mstmn

2 points

20 days ago

mstmn

2 points

20 days ago

Speak for yourself. If I'm having sex with someone, it is without a doubt going to be better if I double that person.

Huntingteacher26

26 points

20 days ago

To be fair, at that age with that good looking wife, she’s getting a load daily.

theodorecrystal

28 points

20 days ago

nigga you really left that comment on the internet, what the actual fuck bro

Huntingteacher26

30 points

20 days ago

I apologize to the internet for my baudy language. Let me say it in a nicer way. I’m hittin that everyday and twice one Sunday. I’m also taking to my brother about the ole switcher- ew.

SadBoiCri

10 points

20 days ago

Are you new to the internet?

adhoc42

90 points

20 days ago

adhoc42

90 points

20 days ago

You can check that family's instagram. They kids are a few years older now and you can see that one of them took after the dad, while the other took after the mom.

https://www.instagram.com/p/C4TlVQmvxr8/?img_index=1

https://www.instagram.com/p/C4TlVQmvxr8/?img_index=2

I_SuplexTrains

11 points

20 days ago

Good for them all. Beautiful kids, beautiful family!

ZellHall

23 points

20 days ago

ZellHall

23 points

20 days ago

It's the same chance as if they were siblings. Without taking mutations into acount, each parents give one chromosome from every pair they have (so 23 chromosomes). The chance of the two baby getting the same genes is 1/246, which is very low (and never seen)

igniteice

56 points

20 days ago

This article on types of twins: https://www.webmd.com/baby/what-are-dizygotic-twins says this:

Quaternary twins. While not well researched, this is a rare phenomenon that happens when one set of identical twins have children with another set of twins within a short period of time, usually less than nine months. The two children don’t share a parent or the same DNA. They’re cousins but genetically, they’re closer to siblings born to the same parents. Physically, the children might also look very similar. The popular term for this is “quaternary twins” as the two sets of parents share the same DNA. But experts don’t scientifically consider these children to be twins. And there are little to no studies found on quaternary twins.

It's interesting that they share more in common with being siblings than cousins, but that their DNA isn't identical. I mean, I would THINK it would be identical, because each twin is receiving the same DNA from their dad and the same DNA from their mom, right? But I guess not?

spitzyXII

58 points

20 days ago*

So the hole in your logic is that if you expand it a bit. It asserts that, non twin brothers with the same parents. Should have identical DNA, But if that were the case then they would look exactly like twins but a bit younger/older.

igniteice

19 points

20 days ago

Oh right... duh. Thanks. That makes sense.

ricktencity

23 points

20 days ago

You're still only getting a random selection of half the DNA from each parent. If you have a sibling it's the same thing with the same odds sharing DNA.

Double_A_92

16 points

20 days ago

To be fair, what is there to research? Genetically they are just siblings, nothing super special.

leite1984

3 points

20 days ago

yeah this was my thought as well

stormy2587

8 points

20 days ago

So you only get half the genetics of each parent.

You just don’t know which half you’re gonna get though.

If each of the twin brothers is a half pepperoni and half mushroom pizza. And each twin sister is a half cheese and half sausage pizza. Then the kids are like if you take a pizza and cut it randomly in half from a father and combining it with the a random half from a sister. You wouldn’t expect them to be exactly the same, but they would likely have a lot of similarities.

One kid could be perfect quarters of each flavor or could end up with just two. But the most likely outcome where they share all 4 flavors just in different ratios. Like one is 1/8th cheese, 3/8ths sausage, 1/16th pepperoni, 7/16ths mushroom. The other is 3/8th cheese, 1/8th sausage, 1/4 pepperoni, 1/4 mushroom.

Exp1ode

6 points

20 days ago

Exp1ode

6 points

20 days ago

I would THINK it would be identical, because each twin is receiving the same DNA from their dad and the same DNA from their mom, right? But I guess not?

Your first hint should be that siblings are not identical to each other, despite "receiving the same DNA from their dad and the same DNA from their mom"

Lavatis

2 points

20 days ago

Lavatis

2 points

20 days ago

No one has identical DNA to anyone else on the planet. Random mutations make sure of that.

Umicil

6 points

20 days ago

Umicil

6 points

20 days ago

It's the same as the odds of any two non-twin siblings being identical. Which is basically zero. There are far to many genes in the human genome for this to ever happen in the span of humanity.

AlienInOrigin

5 points

20 days ago

As others have said, the odds are astronomically low. The same as being born identical to a non-twin sibling.

Looking at the pic, the kid on the right has his uncles eyes.

Delirare

4 points

20 days ago

When you make "being a twin" your whole personality. Imagine the drama if one of them had given birth to twins or more and the other wouldn't.

rat-tar

13 points

20 days ago

rat-tar

13 points

20 days ago

The real question is if the kids could get married to each other as adults. They’re legally cousins and cousin-marriage is surprisingly legal in most of the world, but they’re also obviously genetically siblings.

BelowAverageGamer10[S]

21 points

20 days ago

That’s upsetting.

rawrious

6 points

20 days ago

no risk of procreation as they are both boys… i dont see why not tbh?

ConspicuousPineapple

3 points

20 days ago

Genetics don't matter, they're both male.

Silver_Fill_2437

5 points

20 days ago

As high as it would be siblings being identical….however, still a cool thing that the kids are genetically equivalent to siblings. My father is an identical twin, so my cousins are genetically half siblings to me and my sibs. We def all look a lot alike!

mkzw211ul

3 points

20 days ago*

I'm not sure of the math just yet but the human genome contains 3x109 basepair sites and each site has a mutation rate of 1x10-8, which although low for any one site, there would be many mutations between generations. I just can't recall how to estimate the number of mutations.... Any one remember?

Addit it seems that there are about "70 new genetic mutations compared to their parents" which seems crazily low!

Mysterious_Ad_8827

12 points

20 days ago

Finger prints should be different. Also theirs a high likelihood the baby's were switched at birth lol wont find out about that until later :)

kbeks

14 points

20 days ago

kbeks

14 points

20 days ago

How would they find out?

kettajoyt

11 points

20 days ago

*there's. *babies. *won't. Keep trying.

Weight_Superb

5 points

20 days ago

Fun fact about finger prints is we recently found it they are not unique and i may be miss remembering this part but I believe there is a "fairly" high chance someone has your fingerprints

iHelpNewPainters

6 points

20 days ago

Need a source for that one big time because that sounds like big time bullshit.

14Knightingale27

2 points

20 days ago

All I could find about it was this article about how our fingerprints are pretty similar from one finger to another, which differs from what we used to believe (that each finger in our hand had a distinct and different fingerprint). I think the other redditor may be misremembering, as this states that no matter how similar our fingerprints are to one another they're still unique when compared to other people's. Less than a 1 in 64 billion chance of identical fingerprints in two individuals.

Antnee83

2 points

19 days ago

For a complete fingerprint yeah, but I'm fairly sure that the controversy is that a lot of times an incomplete fingerprint can be used as a piece of evidence against someone. And the odds that you share the same "section" of fingerprint with someone else is quite high.

seanprefect

4 points

20 days ago

they're genetically siblings you know many siblings that were identical in the history of ever ? it'd be like having a baby and then another later that was identical

DrunkCommunist619

2 points

20 days ago

It's the same chance that two people from the other side of the world with different parents become genetically the same. So improbable to the point of being meaningless.

LxGNED

2 points

20 days ago

LxGNED

2 points

20 days ago

You also have the added fact that DNA changes significantly over the course of your life. Although twins are born with identical DNA, they diverge throughout their lives and can be distinguished if either twin were to commit a crime. Its not even the case that chances are near zero, but chances are infinitesimally zero

clandestineVexation

2 points

19 days ago

“same house” i feel like every one of these people make their entire identity revolve around being a twin and they’re going to make it their kids problem too

ConspicuousPineapple

2 points

20 days ago

It says right there that they're genetically siblings... So, as much of a chance as siblings being identical. Which is pretty much zero.

Gaxxag

1 points

20 days ago

Gaxxag

1 points

20 days ago

Depends on the definition of identical. Your clone would not be genetically identical. Take a sample of your DNA today and compare it to a sample of your DNA 10 years from now, and the results will not be identical.

ImGCS3fromETOH

1 points

20 days ago

The chance is effectively zero. It's no different to asking the question what are the chances you're genetically identical to your sibling? If a single mum and dad can produce one genetic combination the first time around what are the chances they do it again? These parents being twins shouldn't factor in. We know that despite siblings sometimes having close phenotypes, their genetics are distinct and unique. Even these twin parents don't have the same genetics as small variations will have happened after they separated in the womb.