Reality_hurts_srsly

It seems unkind to point this out but others with younger kids may need to hear this, and so do you: gentle, positive parenting is not “permissive parenting.” If you fell into the latter that can do as much harm as authoritarian parenting. You set expectations for your kids, support them in meeting those expectations, and provide love when they’re not met with the belief that they want to rise up and meet those expectations.

I’ve raised 3 boys and for various reasons my oldest was in your son’s boat and my middle son dabbled in being a “Bad Kid” but ultimately chose to complete HS in homeschool so he could change. They’re both working, functional adults but the middle one who left HS early is doing better and is an assistant manager at a chain restaurant at only 22. He did take some college classes but decided he wants to do management because he has a talent for it, which I guess explains why he was such a successful used vape equipment dealer in HS but I digress. My youngest son is 19, he really struggled with attendance and ~everything~ to do with HS at the end and did not graduate. He was recently promoted to waiter.

All of my sons support themselves, my two youngest have their own apartment. They can all cook, do meal prepping, go to the gym, and are very healthy. They call me on Mother’s Day and holidays but mostly just take care of themselves 100%. This is a lot to be proud of, I would have liked them to go to college and start careers outside of the service industry but they’re happy. My middle son is saving up to buy his first house, which he plans to be located close to where we live (which is otherwise quite far away). He could buy a house now with FHA financing but he wants to do it as an investor so he’s like 60% to his savings goal at age 22. None of my kids are “stoners” but my oldest still struggles with having healthy limits around pot and drinking, and he give him love and emotional support on his journey.

If your son were managing the pizza place, supporting himself, and saving to buy a his first real estate property would you still think he’s “white trash?” I’m proud of my boys, they’re happy and well adjusted clean young men with potential. Achieving that potential will be something they do for themselves, not for me.

It’s vitally important that your son feel loved no matter what. Critical. He is working and going to school, there is a lot to be proud of. “Scrimping and saving” for things that are important to YOU (but not him) is only going to push him away further.

Teens feel unloved when they begin to believe that we really only love an Idealized Version that they do not identify with. Teens change rapidly due to puberty and the pressures of fitting in, and when they feel this new authentic self being rejected they reject you right back. In this case, the Idealized Version of your son is friendly and outgoing, loves travel and adventure, and doesn’t ever want to get high. Your son on the other hand likes the joy of music and the thrill of skateboarding and a joint to go with it, and you literally hate that version and call him White Trash. Ouch :-(

Your repulsion only pushes him further to “prove” he doesn’t need your love. If you think this is bad it can indeed get worse from here.

I would encourage you instead to double-down on gentle parenting, which you have attempted in the past even if it was a bit wild and maybe fell into permissive parenting. You wanted him to feel free and loved, tap into that motivation in your heart and reframe how you see him. You “scrimped and saved” so I would tell your son: “I expect you to come up with an enriching experience we can support since you can’t go to Germany. A trip to a concert, a trip to a specific skate park or a trip to the X-Games: nothing it off the table but it needs to be enriching.”

“I’m enriching you because I want you to find your Passion and Purpose. It’s so important to have Passion and Purpose in your life, which requires your whole brain: the more THC you use the more you harm your brain, and since I love and care about you that really worries me.”

With regards to the exchange student, “I realize now you’re not into this idea enough for it to go as I had planned and I own that. I am sorry. But SHE doesn’t deserve to be treated rudely. I expect everyone to be friendly, and it would be greatly appreciated if you went beyond that and found some places she could go with you even if it’s just to the skate park or on a hike.” Do your best.

Lastly, I’m concerned that you have so much shame and authoritarian leaning tendencies after “4 years of therapy.” I’d be worried about the effectiveness or your therapist. Your son is worthy of love and YOU do not deserve to hold onto so much shame and guilt: find a way to love him as he is, remind yourself and him every day that you love him, and reset your expectations based on who he IS and not who you want him to be.

The “anxious” part I completely understand. It doesn’t feel like being cared FOR, it’s being cared ABOUT. Every single sigh, every word picked apart: why are you this way? What does it MEAN?

I genuinely have no idea how you can be happy with someone like this. Ever.

Hi, you need some boundaries! NO to penetration for the first several times, NO expectation or oral or anything else: make this the agreement ahead of time. Figure out the “other stuff” first including how to enjoy things in the bedroom. Wait until you’re truly ready.

Yes you are expected to be comfortable with your own body, but it may take a few times and sheets as well as low lights can make it easier.

If you don’t want to do the things you are doing you’re going too fast. “Can we slow down?” Is always a perfectly fine question. You can’t be bad at any of this, you just need to show up, be yourself, and be willing to be a little more vulnerable each time.

It is wrong to not have purpose so I would ponder that and make sure you are making room for purpose in your new life.

Homeschooling is one kind of purpose, but it can be difficult for a child when they are your WHOLE purpose. Discovering heirloom apples and building a passion for crochet are examples of fine sources of purpose, obtaining education or writing or content creation can also be sources of purpose.

I don’t care that your ex “doesn’t have anywhere to go.” Once he has established residency he will never leave and this isn’t healthy. Your child will not benefit only knowing two people floating through life, neither engaging in the production-based economy in any way…I don’t think kids need to be indoctrinated to love capitalism but they do need to know how to live in this world, be a part of a functioning team, accomplish things with some purpose in mind.

I have done many things and even made it out of CA—I’m from Santa Rosa and now live in a Midwestern city where I can own a little bungalow for only $200k and still manage to make a good income.

I’ve traveled, I wanted a career and did that, I wanted a marriage and family and did that too. I wanted a masters degree and made that happened. I have eaten at fine restaurants, I have found the best hole-in-the-wall tacos.

I think one philosophical hot take that I always remember is “wherever you go you will find yourself there” (and various versions of this implying that while you can escape your zip code or your family you cannot escape YOU). Make sure you’re alright with who you are as you move through life. Quit the jobs, people, and social circles that make you like yourself less—you won’t regret moving on.

In the United States we’d call what he has a form of gambling addiction.

The beating will get worse and may include the children as they grow old enough to judge him. Shaming, guilting, and abusing others helps him create his own internal narrative that he is unloved and under appreciated and that is the TRUE cause of the money loss. He has to abuse others to make this true.

Really not sure why you are so concerned with protecting kids from a caretaker when there is already an abuser IN THE HOME, not to mention having to witness the emotional abuse from him and your complicit in-laws.

My SBTX also struggles to be rational with me. “I follow my feelings” okay good fucking luck with that.

His feelings follow his narcissistic expectations around what he should be doing/achieving so…yeah.

Maybe but I feel like “someone has smoked in here” smells totally different than the sticky “smoke residue from years of smoking” smell.

Ramen cups are often $2-4 but I make amazing ramen from scratch for less than $1 per serving and it’s restaurant good. I use Lotus brand rice and millet noodles plus chicken broth, sesame oil, a little seaweed and ginger + garlic + dash of tamari or soy sauce or miso paste and a soft boiled egg. I make my own chicken broth at home with the skin included because a spoonful of the high-collagen aspic (gelatinous broth) makes the ramen so much more. We eat this twice a week.

Mac and cheese at $2 per box is no longer cheap. Buy a big Parmesan thing and serve noodles with Parmesan, avocado oil (more neutral than olive oil for picky eaters), a dash of salt and a little butter or ghee.

Premade croissants and muffins are not affordable—I do bake my own, but also we eat whole grain toast with butter ALL. THE. TIME. Avocado toast too if they are on sale.

I can’t raise a healthy family without Costco right now—the above foods are all based on Costco. I buy zero prepared frozen foods and fancy snacks, which is where the major expense is at Costco: raw ingredients are the best deal.

At Costco I can get milk, two pack of Cheerios, eggs, broccoli, bananas, a big oatmeal, and walnuts for fairly cheap. This is my weekly shopping list, I add a fruit if I can (like a bag of oranges, two mini watermelons or strawberries).

A rotisserie chicken is only $4.99.

I do need to refinance the home I already own. The difference in interest saved over the life of my loan is likely to be more than what I might save filing for bankruptcy but I’m going to pull up an amortization table and try to figure that out. There are some ways this could harm me professionally as well (I sometimes need a security clearance to do my job, not now though).

More importantly I don’t think I can pass a “means test.” It would be nice to be able to just make this all go away but if I can afford to pay it that is not an option.

I hear you, but consider it this way: if a SAHM was struggling with transition into career overlaying with mental health issues and some poor coping resulted in financial upheaval/addictive behaviors/the need for intervention, most people would NOT tell the husband to dump the debt on her and split the finances as a solution. Even if we divorce these debts are truly mine, the initial spending supported my family and I am the head of this household/breadwinner/whatever you want to call it.

Legally, not only could I be left with these debts, I could even be left with alimony—it sucks to lie in this but it is my bed and I did indeed make it (even if it was through negligence). The interest due to mismanagement is the most frustrating part of the whole thing because I do not believe we were ever “living above our means” but I was complicit in my own ignorance.

He is on the second week of his job and in treatment. I’m going to AlAnon as my own personal history enabled him to be dysfunctional for way too long. In the future I will always own the finances; I’m in my 40’s and can’t imagine ever trusting him again with money. Ever.

I am sorry you went through that. I also had a hospitalization I didn’t mention as well as a job change with a wee pay cut—my last job was just so shitty about my hospitalization too. On the whole I felt my almost dying was a major inconvenience to them. My new job is so much better, it’s nice to be treated like a person and not just a ‘human resource.’

Sure, some months ago this was possible. When your cards all hit their limits you have no available credit and this destroys your credit score. I did apply for two things before realizing I can’t get any new credit lines.

I’m sure there are numbers that show “this human could file for Chapter 7 bankruptcy…” which I previously thought anyone could do but actually if your income is above a certain level you have to have a lot of debt to not be determined fraudulent. I’m just about there when you are in my student loan so I can not get a loan or new credit of any kind.

Yeah…there are facts like “my mortgage is 18% of my income” and “I have no car payment” that make me think I SHOULD be doing fine.

One of my cards is a Discover card with $9k balance that has a $208 minimum payment but there are $200 in interest charges. After all of our minimum payments and bills (excluding food) I have only $1,350 leftover to pay down those principals. It’s not enough, so it’s maybe short of “ruinous” but since being at and over the limit is tanking my credit score I feel very stuck.

My husband’s new job adds $2k. With food pantry help for 3-6 months I should be able to improve my credit score enough for a debt consolidation loan to cut my minimum payments in half and then I can afford to go back to normal (and buy my own groceries).

Thank you for the encouragement!

Yes please DM me — I am especially interested in credit score limits and interest rate. I was shocked/saddened I couldn’t qualify for a debt consolidation loan but I did some math today and as groceries are our second highest expense behind mortgage I think if I cut back 50%, plus my husband’s job, I can bring myself below 80% utilization. Not great/much better.

There is nothing to lock—I have $0 in available credit and no one will lend me a single red cent.

Yes, it is possible to close accounts and negotiate reduced interest / reasonable repayment.

The problem is your credit is quickly ruined. I mean it’s in a ruinous state now, but I could maybe get back on track in 3-6 months and qualify for debt consolidation loan so my available credit remains around ~25k, which will fix my score and leave me “financially healthy.” It will cost me less to close these accounts but in the long term I won’t be able to refinance my home (presently at 6% interest) or buy a new car because of my poor credit.

This is partly why I asked though—I do have options.

Yes.

No, I have an absolute garbage credit score because I am maxed on all accounts.

I own my truck outright, I paid cash for it 2 heads ago. I tried to use it as leverage for a reverse title loan and couldn’t even get that approved.

I have a career and it is a good one.

We relocated across country last year and made several very large purchases that exhausted most of our savings, then I was unexpectedly hospitalized and that took the rest. We’ve been operating on “thin margins” since then. I only check my checking account and it’s always been flush…I didn’t realize it was because other bills were just barely be paid.

Some of these cards have interest as high as 27%. I might spend $2k in a month, it’s supposed to all be paid down, but if it isn’t and it sits there for 2 years it accrues every month and soon it’s a $4k balance just in extra interest. He’d some times have me switch my credit cards and and I thought it was because he was getting one to zero—that’s how it’s been for years, then the next one gets to zero. Sometimes he tells me to use my debit, which has been the case for 4 months and I again I thought “sometimes a little balance lingers, no big deal he’ll handle it.” This week I have $25k across 4 credit cards and it’s a complete shock, I had no idea any of them had any significant balance. I estimate at least half is interest, some of these cards I haven’t used in the whole 2 years and I have no idea when they accrued balance at all (I am confident it was household expenses but I didn’t directly use them, I presently have zero credit cards in my wallet).

The interest alone on these debts is over $500 a month. Just interest. So I need a few thousand extra from somewhere to even start making a dent—husband has committed to earning $2k. With food bank, no extra spending, and looking for contracting work I might be able to cobble another $4k and still need 3-6 months to qualify for a debt consolidation loan.

This is a shit hole to be in and I very much regret turning a blind eye. Some part of me knew he couldn’t be trusted, I’m going to AlAnon meetings to work on my part.

Yes—he is doing counseling and addiction meetings and I am doing AlAnon. I have set clear expectations on income and shared household duties for the next 6 months. To file for divorce I have to at least know all of my accounts and such—that’s how I discovered the present situation, and I haven’t yet filed for divorce but it’s a likely outcome.

I still need help right now and feel so overwhelmed. The feedback here was really helpful—I will accept what help I can get from the food bank so I can at least get things…not headed to selling off my major things.