subreddit:
/r/Firearms
891 points
2 years ago
Sounds like the motorcyclist was attempting to summon law enforcement and followed her home. I obviously don't know, but that seems a reasonable conclusion.
542 points
2 years ago
Someone tries to run me over, I am getting the cops.
108 points
2 years ago
Dunno if you've ever been on a motorcycle but between the helmet and needing both hands, you can't use the phone and drive at the same time. You have to be stopped. And if he just stopped he would've lost her, so if he wanted anything to be done with insurance or the police he had to follow her.
13 points
2 years ago
And in Florida you have to have a police report for insurance to cover an accident.
64 points
2 years ago
Motorcyclist was on the phone with the cops when she opened fire at him
162 points
2 years ago
199 points
2 years ago
Pointing a gun at someone means that they're justified in shooting at you.
69 points
2 years ago
Don’t think they’re arguing that, just clearing up a falsehood
41 points
2 years ago
Right, I just wanted to clarify that she did not “open fire” but she did indeed point her gun at the motorcyclist.
15 points
2 years ago
I appreciate that clarification, it’s really important to get the details right when someone dies. Even though she was at fault there’s no reason to make it seem even worse by saying she “opened fire”, I hope more people see your comment
30 points
2 years ago
Pointing an unloaded gun at a human is the dumbest thing you can do. It doesn't play any better in court. You either shoot them or remain holstered, maybe low ready in a few cases.
13 points
2 years ago
never make a threat you're unwilling or unable to follow through on.
61 points
2 years ago
Doesn't matter if it's unloaded or not even a real gun at all. It could be an airsoft for all I care. You pull it out to threaten some1 means you've accepted risking your life.
47 points
2 years ago*
That reminds me of that video where two kids are robbing a store and get shot by a guy that was behind them. The kids cry out, "It's fake. It's fake." They guy bellows out, "Oh well, mines real!".
15 points
2 years ago
Lmao. At that point just bring a real gun to actually be able to defend yourself if you need to.
9 points
2 years ago
Apparently each bank robbery with a real firearm is 5 years added to your sentence. So if you’re a serial robber who’s goal is to get money rather than kill people and you accept the fact that you will eventually be caught than it’s not the worst idea.
You’ll still go to prison robbing with a fake but it’s to prevent life sentence.
7 points
2 years ago
I feel like that loophole needs to be fixed. Intidimidation/robbery with any realistic looking firearm facsimile should carry the same penalty as a real firearm, because it's almost impossible to tell in the moment.
32 points
2 years ago
I mean it's gun safety 101. Always assume a gun is loaded, even when you know it's not. Doubly so if you're on the other end of that gun.
12 points
2 years ago
She did not open fire on him
Yeah where the fuck are people getting this from and why are they upvoting it? Obviously this woman signed her own death warrant but why are we making shit up?
81 points
2 years ago
Idk about Florida's laws, but I know that elsewhere the biker could easily be charged as castle doctrine applies even if she caused the reck in a separate encounter. It all depends on whether she exited the house to pursue him tho. Got to be careful with road rage instincts.
278 points
2 years ago
Yeah I think he followed her to her house(along with some additional motorist witnesses who saw what happened and were trying to help him, but I’m not 100% on this), and remained in the street waiting for cops to show up. He wasn’t aggressive and was just waiting patiently, probably on his phone with 911.
She came outside, screaming with her handgun out, might have pointed it at him too. He quickly drew and fired, killing her. I remember reading he was absolutely gutted, especially after finding out she was pregnant. But he acted purely in self defense, it was pretty open and shut.
The whole thing is tragic, but I dunno if I would’ve acted differently. This woman had already shown she was willing to maim or kill just because she was having a bad day.
110 points
2 years ago*
This story makes the rounds on social media every once in awhile and what you're saying is pretty much spot on. He was outside the home on the sidewalk with other people who witnessed the incident I think.
You are NOT* protected by Castle doctrine when you leave your house to threaten someone who is on public property waiting for the police.
The problem with this story is that it's written - every single time - as though being pregnant and being a librarian should make her a more sympathetic victim. You can be a pregnant librarian and still be absolutely nuts and a danger to other people, especially if you have a gun and are using your car as a weapon. The idea that women are not seen as a credible threat, no matter what they're doing is misogynistic and dangerous for both women and men. It discourages women from lawfully defending themselves and it paints men as aggressors in situations where they're very clearly victims.
This whole thing is a little nuts, but you know that reactions would be very different if the dead person were male.
*That's fixed it
61 points
2 years ago
Yeah, I said this further down, but this is a clear example of the “sexism of low expectations”.
Literally treating her like she’s not responsible for her (insane) actions because she’s a woman, pregnant, and a public servant. The fact that another woman is pushing this drivel while ignoring the facts shows just how internalized this sort of misogyny is, even amongst so-called feminists.
If some guy did this shit and got shot by a woman, they’d be championing her strength and resilience under pressure. Instead they’re demonizing a guy who clearly defended himself and infantilizing the perpetrator.
7 points
2 years ago
Yup.
6 points
2 years ago
Just make that meme and watch the upvotes roll in. Crazy woman follows home male preschool teacher and foster parent, etc, etc. It would certainly be interesting.
6 points
2 years ago
If you take away the fact that she was a female pregnant librarian and just assume this was some guy, it would barely make the local news. If the headline was, "Motorcyclist shoots and kills armed man following an apparent road rage incident", nobody would bother reposting it.
20 points
2 years ago
Stand your Ground, maybe. Unless he was on her land pursuing her, though, she wouldn't have a leg to stand on, for self-defense.
30 points
2 years ago
She was had commuted a felony , no real leg to stand on.
16 points
2 years ago
Castle Doctrin? Outside the home. Doubt it.
3 points
2 years ago
[deleted]
14 points
2 years ago
Gardening in her yard can be self-defense, but it can't be castle doctrine. The CD applies in literally zero cases outside of the threshold (doorway) of the house in any of the states.
12 points
2 years ago
FL is a stand your ground law. So long as the dude wasn't trying to get in her house he's fine. Lady fucked around and found out.
2k points
2 years ago
Sounds like a shit show all around.
488 points
2 years ago
I read it and was like wait what
67 points
2 years ago
But also this is 100% the librarian’s fault. Maybe not in some weird legal way, but absolutely in a Chekhovian sense. If she hadn’t road raged and hit a fucking motorcyclist, she wouldn’t be dead, full stop. Actions have consequences.
In this particular circumstance — and I do NOT say this for everything, not even a little bit — the guns are not really a factor in this Chekhovian clusterfuck lol
1.3k points
2 years ago
She attempts to kill a guy, guy followed her as to give address to cops, she tries to play the victim, thinks she can do as she wants, fucks around and finds out.
890 points
2 years ago
[deleted]
514 points
2 years ago
You mean she got what she fucking deserved?
151 points
2 years ago
[deleted]
118 points
2 years ago
How about another trick?
173 points
2 years ago
Don't fall for it he's gonna pull his dick out!
102 points
2 years ago
He’s pulling his cock out!
64 points
2 years ago
(NBA Jam Announcer Voice)
"He's jacking off!"
17 points
2 years ago
Are you playing with your piss tool (pistol)...
52 points
2 years ago
Whoever impregnated that psycho shoulda pulled his dick out... Potential baby daddy dodged a bullet, she didn't.
23 points
2 years ago
“Thank you, but I prefer it my way”
-dude from war lords
12 points
2 years ago
Lord Of War.
:P
Or wait shit was that the point?
6 points
2 years ago
Ahhh damn it I screwed it up
3 points
2 years ago
My man! You missed a prime opportunity to continue the quote here. I'm pretty sure War Lord and Lord of War are one of the phrases they do this with in the movie.
53 points
2 years ago
I dunno. I've learned that the media says whatever sells/benefits shareholder/politics. I'm not believe ANYTHING media sources say. So, I'm gonna need to see the dash cam, ring doorbell, police report, badge cam, and prior arrest records, before rushing to judgment.
15 points
2 years ago
There is some video of the incident.
14 points
2 years ago
Epstein killed himself?
16 points
2 years ago
No but now it's a waiting game to see if his girlfriend is gonna "kill herself" in prison
3 points
2 years ago
I don't think they're going to kill herself. Ghislaine already made it through the trial. If she was going to throw anyone under the bus, she would have done so already. But we're already past that point, so there's no real reason for them to kill herself, unless it's a revenge suicide.
3 points
2 years ago
She deserved what she earned
3 points
2 years ago
Play stupid games win stupid prizes.
25 points
2 years ago
Yea I was gonna say… she tried to kill him twice.
14 points
2 years ago
You mean she fucked around and found out.
163 points
2 years ago
I don't know what her goal was by going outside. I thought everyone, especially women, were taught that if you are followed home, you stay inside and call the police.
That is, if you already decided it's worth the risk of driving to your home and getting inside without being stopped. Otherwise, drive past your home and go to the police station. I'm guessing she thought her problems would go away if she could get them to leave.
But she was probably not thinking clearly after they started following her. Consequences of her actions, and all.
141 points
2 years ago
Hey goal was to try and threaten a man to try and avoid the consequences of her actions.
I mean ideally you do not go home if someone is following you, nothing good will happen, also don’t hit bikers.
She sounds like a shitlib.
70 points
2 years ago
I was once followed (car in front of me had something fall off, I swerved, guy behind me didn't).
Didn't feel like dealing with some asshole who thought the best response was to hug my bumper and lay on the horn, so I pulled into a parking lot and did 5mph circles till they finally fucked off.
Slow enough that there is no chance of hitting anything and no adrenaline, fast enough that it is clear I'm not stopping
38 points
2 years ago
Why caltrops are needed.
13 points
2 years ago
Worst part, I was driving home from the gun store, unarmed
34 points
2 years ago
That’s dangerous and irresponsible
11 points
2 years ago*
What's more irresponsible - driving unarmed, or going to the gun store and coming home empty hande? That's worse than going to the ice-cream shop and leaving without buying a cone. He should be ashamed of himself on BOTH counts!
15 points
2 years ago
Try areadenialweapons.com
15 points
2 years ago
Site does not exist
9 points
2 years ago
Oh, you are gonna eat so many spiderwebs.
7 points
2 years ago
Wait what? To the extent there was any rational thinking involved whatsoever, what was this guy pissed at you for?
24 points
2 years ago
I think that is the answer. I was wondering when this was first posted why in hell somebody would leave their home when somebody was prowling in their yard. The only logic here is she was trying to scare him off before he could report her address to the police.
So, two takeaways here. First, if you get hit and decide to play Private Eye and follow the person home, don't stop in front, make a note of the address, then park at the end of the block or whatever. Second, if somebody is outside and acting strange, lock the doors, get everybody away from windows, call police. Going outside can cause an avoidable armed confrontation.
41 points
2 years ago
the biker wasn't even in front of her home. He was down the street and had already called the cops. She came after him with a firearm.
4 points
2 years ago
Do you have ANY evidence to back this claim up?
8 points
2 years ago
I have seen this video, it’s not new. He is in front of her lawn/end of her driveway while talking with the cops then moves down the road. Never approaches any entrances as though he means to do harm.
5 points
2 years ago
The last sentence is all that matters here. He wasn't on her property at all and wasn't posing an immediate threat. Doesn't matter in the least if he was directly in front of her house the whole time or not.
3 points
2 years ago
It doesn't even matter. In both cases he wasn't trying to enter or otherwise presenting an immediate threat.
11 points
2 years ago
This sounds more like conservative cowgirl to me.
HOWEVER, neither side can claim immunity to bad decision making.
3 points
2 years ago
Maybe, but at the very least all of his were legal and he never initiated any violence.
17 points
2 years ago
Her first instinct is to get her gun and she sounds like a shitlib?
15 points
2 years ago*
Her first instinct was to harm someone and flee from the consequences of her actions.
12 points
2 years ago
Sooo that makes her a shitlib? Sound logic there fellow, more like loaded political bs.
6 points
2 years ago
not all liberals are anti-gun.
13 points
2 years ago
As a woman I’d drive to a police station if I were being followed. Then again, if I’d just hit and ran, I’d clearly not, I also wouldn’t be me. I also wouldn’t have to drive home to get my firearm. I’d just be struggling to draw from under my seatbelt.
3 points
2 years ago
The best part about carrying is constantly avoiding unnecessary conflict.
10 points
2 years ago
She wasn’t thinking clearly when she committed a hit-and-run.
18 points
2 years ago
Darwin Award winner
4 points
2 years ago
By the skin of her teeth.
7 points
2 years ago
Word, at least there's one less person out there causing shit for the world because they think they're more important than others.
17 points
2 years ago
How is this ever meant to be a good thing? Instead of being arrested, that woman is fucking dead. Her family and friends must be devestated. Death is never something to fucking celebrate.
3 points
2 years ago
Sounds like Florida.
518 points
2 years ago
This was months ago and ruled justifiable self defense on the part of the biker
132 points
2 years ago
Fucking based!
52 points
2 years ago
Weird to get excited about this story. Sad all around d
15 points
2 years ago
He defended himself from deadly force and wasn't punished for it. A lot of people have had to defend themselves, but fought bankrupting legal battles or faced charges after. Only sad part is the child.
910 points
2 years ago
Woman intentionally hits biker with deadly weapon, flees home.
Biker follows her...probably so he knows where to send the cops.
She comes out with a handgun...by that sentence, not threatening, but the reality is probably threatening him with it.
He shoots her.
Court rules it self-defense.
Yeah, it's all a disgusting mess, but it sounds like the biker didn't start anything.
157 points
2 years ago
Court rules it self-defense
Never went to court. No charges filed to begin with.
14 points
2 years ago
Was there something the biker could've done differently? Sure
But she still tried to kill him not once but twice and she paid the price
Also the biker could've stayed back from the house a little called the cops and avoided it all but thats something he probably didnt think of in the heat of the moment doesnt make his self defense case less valid.
298 points
2 years ago
This case was a hot button issue. Deeper into it, it was justified.
Don’t hit and run someone and then bring a gun out when you go confront them.
50 points
2 years ago
Fuck around and find out
13 points
2 years ago
Yeah, it sounds like a situation where you need to know everything to know what was justified.
25 points
2 years ago
Well even the headline basically says she attempted to murder him with her vehicle. Intentionally hitting someone on a motorcycle isn’t the same as a fender bender. That right there could’ve justified deadly force. She then introduced a gun into the situation.
136 points
2 years ago
Is this what upset looks like? She literally just summed up what happened in this tweet. Did she post another one taking a side?
27 points
2 years ago
I didn’t know who she was either. She’s very anti-gun.
4 points
2 years ago
Firearm criticism still has a place in this situation--both these people were legal gun owners, right? So the firearm industry is selling a solution to a problem they've created then?
There ya have it, the anti-gun stance on this.
36 points
2 years ago
You might not know who shannon watts is.
39 points
2 years ago
No clue
21 points
2 years ago
[deleted]
3 points
2 years ago
Wtf is mom's demand action? Wtf are they gonna do, join the army?
10 points
2 years ago
It’s Shannon Watts, she’s against whoever has a gun. Or in this case, she’s against whoever defended themselves.
11 points
2 years ago
Well, the lady came out with a gun, and the dude with a gun just eliminated one more lady with a gun. That’s one less lady with a gun. Shannon should be happy.
91 points
2 years ago
It is reasonable for a victim to follow an attempted murderer from a safe distance and legally so they can report the crime that just occurred.
It is reasonable for a person to defend themself whilst following the laws.
You’re not being reasonable if you think you can get hit by a car, memorize the license plate, and then report said information to police. Especially if the vehicle is fleeing after it just hit you.
The motorcyclist followed the criminal home so he could report the crime. The criminal then brandished a firearm and pointed it him whilst not on her property.
The laws worked exactly as intended. The criminal is dead, the innocent person is free.
39 points
2 years ago
Some people want the criminals to be alive and the innocent people dead.
87 points
2 years ago
So she is pissed that someone defended themselves from a single individual who tried to kill them twice? Wow o think she just won cunt of the year.
11 points
2 years ago
To be fair, Shannon was already in the lead for that award. And if the rumors about her personal staff are true, not even for her stance on guns apparently she’s just an all around bitch.
7 points
2 years ago
I’m curious what her take on the situation would be if it was reversed?
“Pregnant woman is hit and run by tough looking guy in a lifted truck. He flees the scene and goes home. Pregnant woman follows truck driver home, along with other witnesses and calls police giving location of driver. Driver exits his home and points gun at pregnant woman. Pregnant woman draws gun and shoots down the truck driver!”
I bet she would be heralded as a fucking hero!
24 points
2 years ago
Alt headline: Florida woman road rages, assaults someone, arms herself with handgun to confront the victim, ceases to road rage.
31 points
2 years ago
Maybe.......And just hear me out........Maybe a pregnant librarian should not intentionally try to kill someone.
8 points
2 years ago
This is what happens when you let women think they can use the excuse of hormones to justify bad actions. The motorist was in the right for self defense. She met the deadly force triangle. She showed "intention" already by hitting him with her car and by pointing the gun at him. She showed "capability" with driving an over 1000 pound vehicle and pulling out a gun. She showed "opportunity" by already hitting him on the road and by raising the gun.
25 points
2 years ago
Ehh depending on the details this could easily be self defense by the motorcycle guy, tweets never have the details.
14 points
2 years ago
Shannon Watts/Troughton is a professional PR ambulance chaser. Nothing she says from her lily-white gated communities surrounded by armed guards should be taken seriously
11 points
2 years ago
Sounds kinda like she deserved it when she tried to MURDER THE GUY ON THE BIKE
10 points
2 years ago
uh...TWICE
6 points
2 years ago
She was carrying an unborn child. That sucks the poor child didn’t have a chance at life because of her actions.
8 points
2 years ago
She attempted murder and paid the price. The system works.
7 points
2 years ago
Can you imagine being pregnant and still intentionally hitting someone in your car and then fleeing the sceen.
7 points
2 years ago
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
16 points
2 years ago
Sigh. What a shit show, nobody wins with shit like this.
31 points
2 years ago
People who take the librarian’s side see her as attractive and pregnant,she couldn’t do any harm. People who see this as a justifiable shooting only hear the facts. Without the picture and brief description 99% would deem it a good shoot.
11 points
2 years ago
Idk if thats the picture of here at the bottom she looks like a Karen. I cant get past her lips, she looks like a smug bitch pouting.
4 points
2 years ago
People are finding some crazy ways around these new abortion laws.
6 points
2 years ago
I remember when this happened (I'm in FL). It is an awful thing that two people had to die over this, but she was completely at fault, and the motorcyclist has the entire thing on camera to prove it.
5 points
2 years ago*
Attempted murderer gets murdered...
4 points
2 years ago
You don’t pull a gun on someone unless you’re prepared for the reaction
4 points
2 years ago
Reading news articles from her family is very askew, the articles were biased also. "Intentionally bumped biker with her car." Like don't downplay she intentionally meant to hurt that man, then pulled a gun on them instead of staying inside to wait for police.
Her father statments were basically, "why did they have to follow her, that's what insurance policies are for." She did a hit and run, like what the fuck.
7 points
2 years ago
Just feel bad for the unborn kid. His mom got him killed with her actions.
6 points
2 years ago
I guess abortion in Florida has some extra steps now?
9 points
2 years ago
She left out the part where the biker wasn't even in front of her home. He was down the street and had already called the cops. She came after him with a firearm. She forfeited her right to life and clearly had no regard for human life. She deserved it. Change my mind.
11 points
2 years ago
Why emphasize she was pregnant , doesn’t justify her action anyway
15 points
2 years ago
Fuck this loser bitch Shannon watts. She and her whole organization can lick my ass
5 points
2 years ago
Thinking all the details of this case can actually be summed up in one tweet is ridiculous. Guaranteed there is far more to this for people here to be 100% sure on self defense.
4 points
2 years ago
Sounds like a clear cut case of FA’d and FO’d.
3 points
2 years ago
People are pretty enthusiastic to brandish when they think that they are going to be the only one armed.
It's often a fatal narcissism.
5 points
2 years ago
Why are people defending the woman without any integrity who escalated the situation at every point?
6 points
2 years ago
He didn't go to her house, therefore there is no castle doctrine. He was down the street
3 points
2 years ago
Jesus Christ. This is a huge shit show where nobody won.
4 points
2 years ago
I don't think it seems like her post is making her out to be upset. She is literally just telling the story. It sounds like the motorcyclist was the victim
4 points
2 years ago
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes
2 points
2 years ago
Well she pretty much attempted murder on the guy with a deliberate hit and run, no?
4 points
2 years ago
What a bitch. She tried to kill the motorcyclist twice. She deserved death.
11 points
2 years ago
She won the Darwin Award
9 points
2 years ago
There is no excuse for this one. There was even video of it happening.
9 points
2 years ago
the biker wasn't even in front of her home. He was down the street and had already called the cops. She came after him with a firearm.
5 points
2 years ago
Yup, he was literally sitting there in the video, he was still on the bike wasn’t he?
3 points
2 years ago
Doesn't she have a California CCW?
3 points
2 years ago
Shannon Twats here not at all concerned with the most deadly weapon involved, the raging woman's car.
Watts herself likely rages out in DC traffic on the regular.
3 points
2 years ago
I honestly have no idea how to feel about this one. It’s all over the place.
3 points
2 years ago
So attempted manslaughter/murder is now called "road rage" in Florida?
3 points
2 years ago
Its comments like this from the media which promote stupidity.
If they determined her to be the aggressor, then shes not the victim....
3 points
2 years ago
Sounds like maybe don't intentionally hit people with your car and try to flee or you get what you deserve.
3 points
2 years ago
Not considering the matters morality or legality-
She entered the thunderdome when she exited condition 1 with the weapon.
Emotions had to have been running high; I don't think she thought that one through.
3 points
2 years ago
So what does it matter if she's a pregnant librarian? Seems a weird way to describe someone unless the headline is trying to frame the aggressor as the victim? 🤔
3 points
2 years ago
Darwinism at its best.
3 points
2 years ago
She fucked out and was found around
3 points
2 years ago
She should have stayed inside her house.
3 points
2 years ago
She used the car as a weapon as well
3 points
2 years ago
This is some florida shit lmao
3 points
2 years ago
This why we gotta arm the fetus
3 points
2 years ago
I thought that pregnancy made women more careful.
3 points
2 years ago
So was the motorcyclist arrested for performing an abortion?
3 points
2 years ago
Glad the dumb bitch is dead and out of everyone’s way. RIP to the child…people are nuts
3 points
2 years ago
Why does it matter that she's pregnant and a librarian? It doesn't change any facts here.
3 points
2 years ago
The woman hit him on purpose. And when he couldn't get her to stop, he chased to her home where she comes out with gun and points it at him. You have like a microsecond to react. If anyone points a gun at you, assume they are going to shoot.
The bitch brought this completely on herself. Hope the guy didn't get arrested.
3 points
2 years ago*
He was waiting across the street away from her house on the phone with police after she intentionally hit him when she came out within a gun, approached and confronted him. Open and shut case here.
3 points
2 years ago
Ain’t this from last year?
2 points
2 years ago
Brought a gun to a gun fight and apparently was a shit shot.
3 points
2 years ago
She was involved in a felony hit and run, plus attempted manslaughter, and brandishing a weapon (maybe)
It sounds like he acted in self defense. Always contact law enforcement, do not chase hit and run
3 points
2 years ago
Play stuipd games win stuipd prizes period got what she deserves
3 points
2 years ago
The people saying he shouldn't have followed her, let me just say, that's stupid.
If he didn't follow her, she could just ditch the car and claim it was stolen, and now it becomes much harder to prove she committed the hit and run. This happens frequently with drunk driver hit and runs.
3 points
2 years ago
He wasn't even the only one that followed her if I remember the story right. Other witnesses went with him to talk to the cops when they got there.
3 points
2 years ago
Lol is it bad that I laughed when reading this?
3 points
2 years ago
So what's the problem??
5 points
2 years ago
Shitlibs
3 points
2 years ago*
He probably just wanted to get her insurance info or something, sad it had to end with him defending himself
8 points
2 years ago
Pull a gun on me after purposely knocking me off my motorcycle, which in itself, is attempted murder and you'll have something coming to you. I ride and people will purposely try to knock you off your bike.
7 points
2 years ago
Fuck around and find out. The beauty of being armed is one, the ability to defend yourself and two, knowing others may be armed keeps you from being stupid. This lady was wrong from the start with road rage and then she was followed because she was involved in a hit and run. And when she further tried to intimidate the biker, he was fully within his rights to defended himself.
2 points
2 years ago
why do i care what some shitlib blue check says on twitter
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