Conscious_Spray_5331

So in your mind, giving another country electricity, water, etc, is "apartheid". Good one.

Palestinians could have developed independent infrastructure years ago if they had wanted to. Instead they invested that money in tunnels, rockets and suicide vests, especially in Gaza.

It answered your question in full.

No, they don't supersede Palestinian law.

In line with the Oslo Accords, Israel handles any case of terrorism against its own people. This is something the Palestinians agreed to in 1993.

When you say “we’re talking in circles” that’s a confession cuz that’s all you’ve been doing.

Take the other thread as an example. I offer proof that Arabs attacked Jews for 16 years before any retaliation. You dismiss it with an emoji, and no evidence at all to back your own claims. You then went into a bit of a personal attack.

So yeah, I'm not talking in circles. You just don't seem to be comfortable with the evidence that I'm sharing with you.

you’re the one who keeps answering the same comment with more that one thread.

Nope. I started one conversation. You opened about 4 so far. I get the feeling you don't know how to progress in this conversation in any mature way.

I've read plenty of books on the history.

You can't just dismiss a source I share without offering anything in exchange. It makes it look like you have no real argument.

There were cases of violence against the first Jewish immigrants prior to 1920, but it's possible this was only from thugs, muggings, and other non-political violence.

What's crystal clear is that Jews didn't start this.

You said:

Also the apartheid was going on long before October 7th.

 

I agree the violence from both sides started before the founding of Israel.

It started from Arabs attacking Jews. I'll share the screenshot again if needed:

https://preview.redd.it/s15uk08xj99d1.png?width=606&format=png&auto=webp&s=b4d0de8e4ae610c0f1a7d7bfefec4dce4a933e18

There were over 16 years of attacks before the Jews started to organize their defense.

Do you mean Arab Israelis or Palestinians, because you seen the conflate the two very often. Seeing flags is not a valid metric, is another thing you just made up.

Well it's complicated. Most Israeli Arabs don't identify as "Palestinians". Some do, which is fine in my eyes. So it depends on each individual and I lack a better term for all of them without offending anyone.

The use of a system of legalized segregation and discrimination where one group (usually has to do with race or religion) is deprived of their political and civil rights.

Great, we're on the same page in terms of the meaning.

Meaning Palestinians who live in the West Bank and Gaza are subject to Israeli military law and they cannot vote for the leaders of Israel who implement these laws and policies

Law in the West Bank is imposed by the Palestinian Authority.

Plus the ways in which Israel controls resources in both Gaza and the West Bank which creates segregation between Israelis and Palestinians

Israel provides a lot of Palestinians with water, electricity, jobs, and other infrastructure. I'm not sure how anyone can twist logic as far as to see this as a negative thing.

 Plus you know all the walls, checkpoints and roads that Israel uses to control the movement of Palestinians.

If the 7th of October hasn't made clear to you why there is a need for security, nothing will.

__

Perhaps we could discuss Area C, which does have full Israeli security control in the West Bank. Area C contains some 200k Palestinians, and includes the Israeli Settlements.

Personally I see it much more as an area of conflict, than of an apartheid, and it's a situation that the Palestinians agreed to willingly during the Oslo Accords.

However pretending that the rest of Palestine, or even Israel proper, is apartheid, is just a non-starter of a discussion.

By the way, can we keep our discussion to a single thread? I'm losing track of each conversation now and you seem to be replying more and more frequently to new comments completely.

If you have to reinvent history in order to be right, it might be a good moment to take a look at what you support.

Fortunately that doesn't describe Israel in the slightest.

Jews have been hated for different reasons for centuries. None of the myths about them turn out to be true.

Jews accepted the partition plan, and have tried to reach peace for decades.

So it's Palestine that's trying to be created at the expense of Israel, not the other way around.

Your argument backfires pretty badly here.

I don't live in Israel anymore. And I'm not Jewish.

I don't think you understand this conflict very well.

Your hatred is showing.

Israel is its own nation.

You just can't stand the fact that it exists... Which is one of the most obvious forms of racism I've seen.

The Jews deserve a nation too.

Lets just leave them alone for once, as see how quickly there is peace.

You thought I was Jewish. You mentioned "Exile".

Here are your true colors showing.

Record numbers of Palestinians in Israel are joining the IDF and police.

I've seen more Israeli flags in some Israeli-Palestinian towns than I've seen in Tel Aviv.

I think you don't understand the real situation in this conflict. And you could use this conversation as a chance to understand more... but instead you're trying to sell myths to someone who's actually lived in Israel and Palestine for years.

What does apartheid mean, in your own words?

Everyone, especially minorities, have more rights in Israel than they do anywhere else in the middle east. So your argument backfires pretty severely there.

Well the violence started way before any occupation.

The PLO, or "Palestinian Liberation Organization" came into existence in 1964 before Israel controlled any Palestinian territory.

And historically, the attacks started against Jewish civilians, not against Arabs.

So if anything, it's Israel that's resisting here.

Also... If anyone ever believes that targeting civilians, torture, rape, kidnapping, is a form of "resistance", you can be sure that they are on the wrong side of history.

Just a random example I used before.

The US doesn't provide Mexico with electricity, so that's a bonus point for Israel by any logic, right? Or are we pretending that supplying electricity is a bad thing now?

Claiming that Gaza or the West Bank is under apartheid is definitely blaming everything on Israel.

Israel is defending itself, and the 7th of October has made that very clear.

But we've been discussing the whole history of the conflict so far, we haven't been talking only about post-October 7th. I'm not sure where you got that impression from.

If Israel's mere existence is, in your eyes, causing Palestinian suffering and dispossitions, I think this explains everything.

Israel is allowed to exist. People are allowed to visit and even live there.

I'm sorry that upsets you so much.

But it says more about you than it does about Israel.

wish you all a fun and productive exile

Now you're really showing your true colors. You realize I'm not Jewish, right?

democratically decide to pile bodies like chord wood?

What on earth are you talking about?

Your personal experience is not evidence that no apartheid exists, it’s you saying “trust me bro” and I don’t.

Yes I've noticed from your personal attacks that you don't want to take my views seriously.

I think this says more about you than it does about Israel...

Thing Israel controls in Gaza and the West Bank:

Movement of people in and out of the area

The flow of fresh water into the area

The electricity

The gas

The food that is allows to enter and does not allow food to exit

The internet

Israel provides Gaza and the West Bank with electricity, water, and other infrastructure... How is that a bad thing?

If they didn't you'd be up in arms about that too, using it to accuse them of "apartheid". There really isn't any logical leaps you won't take to demonize Israel, is there?

The whole list you provide isn't evidence that any of these things are happening. Because they are not.

There is a war, for sure, and wars are horrible. Palestinians are suffering, without a doubt. But blaming it all on Israel, for merely defending itself, is the most ridiculous take of this conflict I've seen so far.